Science Frozen Dinners and My Carbon Footprint: A Question

**Rain Man** · 08:53 PM

If I bring my frozen dinner (lunch, to be more precise) in to the office, I have two options for storage. I can put it in the freezer until it's time to nuke it, or I can leave it on my desk.

Let's examine a situation in the summer. Some little lump of coal is working to provide air conditioning to my office, so it makes a lot of sense to leave my frozen dinner on my desk. The dinner thaws, which cools the office and simultaneously requires less microwave energy when lunchtime arrives, and on top of that no lumps of coal are used by the freezer to keep the dinner frozen for those four hours. I'm being a responsible citizen and I'm increasing the Coal Era by another 1/1000th of a second. Everyone wins.

The real question is the winter. Let's say that it's 20 degrees outside. Now a little lump of coal is working to heat my office. If I leave my frozen dinner on my desk, it takes less microwave power at lunchtime and less freezer power (I think), but at the same time it's working in opposition to the office-heating lump of coal. Or does it take less freezer power? If I bring it straight from home it's still frozen, so as long as it doesn't heat up over the temperature of the freezer it would actually help cool the freezer. This is another unknown.

In the other option, if I put my frozen dinner in the freezer during the winter, will the freezer use more or less energy before lunch? I'm not sure. We do know that it'll eventually take more microwave power to cook it, but then again it won't be cooling down my office, which needs heat.

So in winter should I put my frozen dinner in the freezer or leave it on my desk? I want to minimize my carbon footprint.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-19-2009, 08:51 PM

Entropy always wins.

Doesn't matter.

blueballs · 02-19-2009, 08:54 PM

opening the freezer is wasting cold air /blueballsmom

**Buck** · 02-19-2009, 08:54 PM

So whats the name of the strain you've been smoking tonight?

**Bugeater** · 02-19-2009, 09:16 PM

Dude, you're loaded, why the hell are you eating TV dinners?

**Bearcat** · 02-19-2009, 09:23 PM

What if you stored it in the microwave until you were ready to heat it up? I doubt the cooling effect in the microwave would make much of a difference, and it wouldn't fight the heat. Others might get angry that you're storing your food in the microwave, but when they start bringing sandwiches, it'll help even more, because they won't be using the microwave.

You could store it in the refrigerator. It's not quite the desk, and not quite the freezer, but mannn...

What if you left it in your car? It would stay frozen, unless you park outside in the sun. In that case, it might thaw a little, and you would get a little exercise.

Or, you could get a lunchbox and do some scientific research on the temperature changes in your office with and without the lunchbox, to determine if it helps any. Your productivity would go down, but you're saving the world, so that's a plus.

jidar · 02-19-2009, 11:24 PM

Ultimately the TV dinner is going to achieve the same temperature before you eat it regardless of if you let it defrost on your desk or keep it frozen.

So the question becomes, what is the more efficient means of heat, heating it with your central office heating system or heating it with the microwave?

Radiation is a more efficient means of heat transfer than convection, but mostly because convection heats up so much more than just the target (it heats up all the air space!) but since you were doing that anyway then perhaps then you can't consider that lost energy. Also, microwaves are tuned for speed and thus use a massive amount of power to radiate heat into the food in the shortest time possible.

In any case, Logic tells me that microwaves are tuned for speed, not efficiency while central heating systems are precisely the opposite, so to this end my feeling is that even in the winter it is better to let the tv dinner thaw on the counter first to minimize the amount of time you spent with the microwave on.
However, I could be wrong.

RJ · 02-19-2009, 11:28 PM

Is it a TV dinner in those aluminum trays? Cause those things will make your microwave blow up.

I'll bet your favorite is the salisbury steak with corn and mashed potatoes and that apple desert thingy.

**rockymtnchief** · 02-19-2009, 11:35 PM

It's been proven that a full fridge/freezer uses less energy than an empty one. Stock the freezer completely full of your salisbury steak and chicken pot pies to save the enviroment.

stlchiefs · 02-20-2009, 12:11 AM

I'd be more worried about the back of the box that says, "Do Not Thaw".

jidar · 02-20-2009, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockymtnchief

It's been proven that a full fridge/freezer uses less energy than an empty one. Stock the freezer completely full of your salisbury steak and chicken pot pies to save the enviroment.

Be careful of repeating things you've heard as "proven"

Once a fridge is closed, the only variables that affects it's energy consumption are how fast the heat moves through the insulation and walls.

big nasty kcnut · 02-20-2009, 08:00 AM

Rain man it don't matter cause as long as you use a plastic fork and then recycle the plastics your ok. Stop thinking about your harming the planet your not as long as we can find alt. stuffs for fuels but don't use food for fuel we are ok. Folks stop stressing and enjoy life and treat everybody decent. Enjoy that food rain man and do a market research on hot looking babes and send the hot babes to my house so i can help you out.
Posted via Mobile Device

bdeg · 02-20-2009, 08:17 AM

In the winter opening the freezer makes the freezer work more, and makes the heater work more. Leave it on your desk!

**Dartgod** · 02-20-2009, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big nasty kcnut

Rain man it don't matter cause as long as you use a plastic fork and then recycle the plastics your ok. Stop thinking about your harming the planet your not as long as we can find alt. stuffs for fuels but don't use food for fuel we are ok. Folks stop stressing and enjoy life and treat everybody decent. Enjoy that food rain man and do a market research on hot looking babes and send the hot babes to my house so i can help you out.
Posted via Mobile Device

The heat generated by my brain while attempting to decipher this post just increased the global temperature by .0001th of a degree.

Just messing with ya, nut!

View Poll Results: In the winter, it's more environmentally responsible to...
...put your frozen dinner in the freezer.	3	27.27%
...leave your frozen dinner on your desk.	4	36.36%
...stop eating completely.	2	18.18%
Y'know, this would make a great class project.	2	18.18%
Voters: 11. You may not vote on this poll

02-19-2009, 08:48 PM
Rain Man Seize life. Be an ermine. Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $-692449 VARSITY	Frozen Dinners and My Carbon Footprint: A Question If I bring my frozen dinner (lunch, to be more precise) in to the office, I have two options for storage. I can put it in the freezer until it's time to nuke it, or I can leave it on my desk. Let's examine a situation in the summer. Some little lump of coal is working to provide air conditioning to my office, so it makes a lot of sense to leave my frozen dinner on my desk. The dinner thaws, which cools the office and simultaneously requires less microwave energy when lunchtime arrives, and on top of that no lumps of coal are used by the freezer to keep the dinner frozen for those four hours. I'm being a responsible citizen and I'm increasing the Coal Era by another 1/1000th of a second. Everyone wins. The real question is the winter. Let's say that it's 20 degrees outside. Now a little lump of coal is working to heat my office. If I leave my frozen dinner on my desk, it takes less microwave power at lunchtime and less freezer power (I think), but at the same time it's working in opposition to the office-heating lump of coal. Or does it take less freezer power? If I bring it straight from home it's still frozen, so as long as it doesn't heat up over the temperature of the freezer it would actually help cool the freezer. This is another unknown. In the other option, if I put my frozen dinner in the freezer during the winter, will the freezer use more or less energy before lunch? I'm not sure. We do know that it'll eventually take more microwave power to cook it, but then again it won't be cooling down my office, which needs heat. So in winter should I put my frozen dinner in the freezer or leave it on my desk? I want to minimize my carbon footprint. Last edited by Rain Man; 02-19-2009 at 08:53 PM..
Posts: 145,520

02-19-2009, 08:51 PM	#2
'Hamas' Jenkins Now you've pissed me off! Join Date: Jan 2006 Casino cash: $7129572	Entropy always wins. Doesn't matter. __________________ "When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read 'all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics.' When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty – to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy.”--Abraham Lincoln
Posts: 75,083

02-19-2009, 08:54 PM	#3
blueballs Banned Join Date: Feb 2006 Casino cash: $10004900	opening the freezer is wasting cold air /blueballsmom
Posts: 14,233

02-19-2009, 08:54 PM	#4
Buck Take a Chill Pill Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: South Carolina Casino cash: $5980295	So whats the name of the strain you've been smoking tonight?
Posts: 44,607

02-19-2009, 09:16 PM	#5
Bugeater The Maintenance Guy Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Renovated Bugeater Estate Casino cash: $3992680	Dude, you're loaded, why the hell are you eating TV dinners?
Posts: 70,546

02-19-2009, 09:23 PM	#6
Bearcat Would an idiot do that? Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Arizona Casino cash: $-1085069	What if you stored it in the microwave until you were ready to heat it up? I doubt the cooling effect in the microwave would make much of a difference, and it wouldn't fight the heat. Others might get angry that you're storing your food in the microwave, but when they start bringing sandwiches, it'll help even more, because they won't be using the microwave. You could store it in the refrigerator. It's not quite the desk, and not quite the freezer, but mannn... What if you left it in your car? It would stay frozen, unless you park outside in the sun. In that case, it might thaw a little, and you would get a little exercise. Or, you could get a lunchbox and do some scientific research on the temperature changes in your office with and without the lunchbox, to determine if it helps any. Your productivity would go down, but you're saving the world, so that's a plus.
Posts: 59,626

02-19-2009, 11:24 PM	#7
jidar MVP Join Date: May 2005 Location: a Casino cash: $10004900	Ultimately the TV dinner is going to achieve the same temperature before you eat it regardless of if you let it defrost on your desk or keep it frozen. So the question becomes, what is the more efficient means of heat, heating it with your central office heating system or heating it with the microwave? Radiation is a more efficient means of heat transfer than convection, but mostly because convection heats up so much more than just the target (it heats up all the air space!) but since you were doing that anyway then perhaps then you can't consider that lost energy. Also, microwaves are tuned for speed and thus use a massive amount of power to radiate heat into the food in the shortest time possible. In any case, Logic tells me that microwaves are tuned for speed, not efficiency while central heating systems are precisely the opposite, so to this end my feeling is that even in the winter it is better to let the tv dinner thaw on the counter first to minimize the amount of time you spent with the microwave on. However, I could be wrong.
Posts: 5,502

02-19-2009, 11:28 PM	#8
RJ Supporter Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: In a shotgun shack Casino cash: $9895202	Is it a TV dinner in those aluminum trays? Cause those things will make your microwave blow up. I'll bet your favorite is the salisbury steak with corn and mashed potatoes and that apple desert thingy.
Posts: 14,940

02-19-2009, 11:35 PM	#9
rockymtnchief Supporter Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: The Crazys of Montana Casino cash: $10018968 VARSITY	It's been proven that a full fridge/freezer uses less energy than an empty one. Stock the freezer completely full of your salisbury steak and chicken pot pies to save the enviroment.
Posts: 5,740

02-20-2009, 12:11 AM	#10
stlchiefs Veteran Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: St. Loser, MO Casino cash: $10005674	I'd be more worried about the back of the box that says, "Do Not Thaw".
Posts: 4,160

02-20-2009, 08:00 AM	#12
big nasty kcnut The pizza king of kansas Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Somewhere in the u.s.a. Casino cash: $-2239100	Rain man it don't matter cause as long as you use a plastic fork and then recycle the plastics your ok. Stop thinking about your harming the planet your not as long as we can find alt. stuffs for fuels but don't use food for fuel we are ok. Folks stop stressing and enjoy life and treat everybody decent. Enjoy that food rain man and do a market research on hot looking babes and send the hot babes to my house so i can help you out. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 19,419

02-20-2009, 08:17 AM	#13
bdeg Veteran Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: iowa Casino cash: $10004900	In the winter opening the freezer makes the freezer work more, and makes the heater work more. Leave it on your desk!
Posts: 2,987