Chiefs sign Zach Thomas

[phisherman]

http://www.kansascity.com/news/break...y/1137526.html

The Chiefs have agreed to terms with linebacker Zach Thomas.

Thomas, 35, is a 13-year veteran who started 14 games for the Dallas Cowboys last season and has made 20.5 career sacks. He spent the first 12 years of his career with the Miami Dolphins.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

While I now have you on ignore, this just had to be addressed. Tedy Bruschi was a defensive end for most of his college career. He became an ILB in the NFL.

Pierre Woods was a linebacker at Michigan and is an OLB in New England. Tully Banta-Cain played outside linebacker before shifting to defensive end in college, and then back to OLB in New England.

Details, details, I know.....

Yes, details. They are the exception. Not the rule. It's the same as saying that every 6th round pick can be a pro bowl quarterback because Tom Brady was picked in the 6th round. Yes, DL can play ILB in a 3-4 or OLB in a 4-3. But it rarely, rarely ever happens, just like OLBs playing 3-4 rarely ever happen.

Now, as for your argument about Raji, finally we agree on something. I think when you're talking about a 3-4, Raji, Everett Brown, and even a Robert Ayers carry a lot more value than Curry. Now, you've been arguing all this time about Curry deserving to be in the top 5. Look, I agree with you on that. I think in a 4-3, Curry is going to be good enough, especially in this draft class, to warrant a #3 pick. But in a 3-4, he's not worth a pick that high.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

Yes, details. They are the exception. Not the rule. It's the same as saying that every 6th round pick can be a pro bowl quarterback because Tom Brady was picked in the 6th round. Yes, DL can play ILB in a 3-4 or OLB in a 4-3. But it rarely, rarely ever happens, just like OLBs playing 3-4 rarely ever happen.

Now, as for your argument about Raji, finally we agree on something. I think when you're talking about a 3-4, Raji, Everett Brown, and even a Robert Ayers carry a lot more value than Curry. Now, you've been arguing all this time about Curry deserving to be in the top 5. Look, I agree with you on that. I think in a 4-3, Curry is going to be good enough, especially in this draft class, to warrant a #3 pick. But in a 3-4, he's not worth a pick that high.

I love "ignore willpower breakage".

[lostcause]

Originally Posted by Mecca

I'll say it again, I dare anyone to point to me a 3-4 OLB that played traditional LB and never played end.

Derrick Thomas?

[ChiefsCountry]

Originally Posted by lostcause

Derrick Thomas?

Nope he played end in Gunther's scheme.

[lostcause]

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

Nope he played end in Gunther's scheme.

Believe it was a 3-4 in 90 and 91.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by lostcause

Derrick Thomas?

It's probably one of the closest examples you can find, but DT was also a Defensive End at Alabama. So he had significant experience in college. And even though he was a 4-3 LB, he was an untraditional LB--the Falcon position, as it came to be known.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by Mecca

I'll say it again, I dare anyone to point to me a 3-4 OLB that played traditional LB and never played end.

Kevin Green played outside linebacker at Alabama and played outside backer his whole career.

Greg Lloyd was an outside linebacker at Fort Valley State and never played end. He was an outside backer his whole career.

Chad Brown started as an inside backer with the Steelers then moved to outside once Lloyd left I believe. He was never an end until he went to Seattle.

James Harrison never played end in the NFL. Not sure at Kent State. He was an outside backer from day 1 both with the Steelers and the Ravens.

Cornelius Bennett never played end in college or in the pros. He was an outside linebacker his whole career.

That is just off the top of my head. Either way, if the point you are trying to make is that only ends can play outside linebacker, then you don't have one. Gusy like Green, Lloyd, Bennett, etc are not anomalies in a 30 front. Lots of traditional linebackers play outside in 30 fronts.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by lostcause

Believe it was a 3-4 in 90 and 91.

True, but he ALWAYS lined up on end.

[bdeg]

But I bet if you look at percentages most 3-4 olb's, especially those used primarily to rush, especially those who had an immediate impact, played some DE in college.

I realize that isn't exactly the point he was making, but it shouldn't be entirely dismissed.

edit: or they at least had sacks in college like Sintim.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by bdeg

But I bet if you look at percentages most 3-4 olb's, especially those used primarily to rush, especially those who had an immediate impact, played some DE in college.

I realize that isn't exactly the point he was making, but it shouldn't be entirely dismissed.

edit: or they at least had sacks in college like Sintim.

Most college players, esp defensive players, line up all over the place. Lots of NFL players do as well. A few years ago the Saints used their middle linebacker at the time, Charlie Clemons, as their hybrid rush end on passing downs. THEIR MIDDLE LINEBACKER. He had 14 sacks doing it. He was the teams leading tackler as well.

The point is, if you want to draw a line in the sand and say "name me a guy that never put his hand in the dirt" then it is possible that NO one can be listed. Because at some point most linebackers played a few downs with their hand in the dirt at some level. However rushing from the outside spot in a 30 front where the tackle is covered up by an end or guard isn't the same as rushing with your hand in the dirt. So a guy can come in as a traditional linebacker and become a good pass rusher from the stand up position without ever having played most of his time at end. Why? Because it's two different animals. James Harrison could not line up in a 40 front defense and collect 15 sacks a year. Write that down. Wouldn't happen. Jared Allen on the other hand, doesn't have the quickness off of a 9 technique to get 15 sacks either. He does it from the end postion because his is a grinder with great leverage and long arms. Jared has the ability to beat guys from up close. He would not be as effective lining up wide like a linebacker in a 30 front. Harrison uses his short leverages to beat guys from a wide position, and because he's very explosive in that short distance.

It's really apples and oranges. Some guys can do both. Some can't. It's really about the player and not his position.

[jidar]

This clearly means they are taking Crabtree at #3

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

Kevin Green played outside linebacker at Alabama and played outside backer his whole career.

Greg Lloyd was an outside linebacker at Fort Valley State and never played end. He was an outside backer his whole career.

Chad Brown started as an inside backer with the Steelers then moved to outside once Lloyd left I believe. He was never an end until he went to Seattle.

James Harrison never played end in the NFL. Not sure at Kent State. He was an outside backer from day 1 both with the Steelers and the Ravens.

Cornelius Bennett never played end in college or in the pros. He was an outside linebacker his whole career.

That is just off the top of my head. Either way, if the point you are trying to make is that only ends can play outside linebacker, then you don't have one. Gusy like Green, Lloyd, Bennett, etc are not anomalies in a 30 front. Lots of traditional linebackers play outside in 30 fronts.

To the extent that it's possible, I'd be interested to know how many of those college teams ran 3-4 defenses and how many of those guys actually transitioned from 4-3 LB to 3-4 LB.

[KcFanInGA]

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

this is about the locker room as much the field....fine by me

Agree. This is how I would build a dynasty. Bring vets to school the rooks. I know its been said a thousand times on here, but it still makes sense. Even heard something the other day about LJ shaping up.