Football Football and Religion

**Rain Man** · 11-28-2009, 12:49 PM

A Reggie White discussion on another thread got me thinking about football and religion. I could be wrong, but it seems like football has a disproportional number of very religious people. Kurt Warner springs to mind, but you also have your Reggie Whites and Rod Woodsons and your Chiefs kickers pointing to the sky after every kick and lots and lots of players who are pretty sure that Jesus follows their team even when there's a local blackout.

So it got me wondering. Are any or all of the following true?

Theory 1. Religious Amplification. Players who reach the NFL have to realize that they've achieved the American Dream. Many of them are from more humble backgrounds or at least no greater than middle class. Do some of these players come to believe that there had to be a greater power or destiny involved in achieving great prosperity, which either amplified their religious beliefs or perhaps creates religious beliefs that may not have been there if they hadn't become successful?

Theory 2. Religious Power. Players who reach the NFL must have enormous talent, but also enormous drive and faith in their ability. Are players with stronger religious beliefs more likely to achieve this success because they have religion as a support structure?

Theory 3. Religious Demographics. Players who reach the NFL happen to come from families where religion is more common and more open for discussion. Southern players, African American players, etc. (I don't know if religion is more common and open among southerners and African Americans in my example. I just have that perception, and others can correct me or expound.)

Theory 4. Flawed Observation. Theory 4 is that I'm wrong in my initial observation, and NFL players are not disproportionately religious.

What do you think? I don't think these theories are independent of each other, so more than one could be true. Or there could be something else I'm not recognizing.

Pioli Zombie · 11-28-2009, 01:42 PM

4 Flawed. Believers give the glory to God whether they achieve or not.
Posted via Mobile Device

SenselessChiefsFan · 11-28-2009, 01:53 PM

The NFL is a cross section of society. It just so happens they have a much larger stage than the rest of us.

Additionally, they are used to being accepted and don't feel much apprehension about sharing their faith.

Psyko Tek · 11-28-2009, 02:00 PM

everybody remember Bull Durham?

when coster is coaching up Nuke, on how to give an interview?

that's my theory

Thig Lyfe · 11-28-2009, 02:09 PM

Godless liberal pinko commmie hippie socialists generally don't get their kids into sports as much as God-fearing patriotic flag-waving Americans. Sports are very closely tied to nationalism (see the Olympics) and in America, nationalism is very closely tied to religion. The same kind of people who endorsed Manifest Destiny back in the day are the same people who invest a lot of their time and energy in sports -- there's a drive, perhaps even a lust, for competitive achievement that seems to be inherent in American Christianity.

Conservatism and Christianity are practically synonymous in America these days, and what's more free market than the clearly defined winner/loser system of sports?

Also, I think your observations are correct: African-Americans are, in general, actually quite socially conservative and religious. But their attraction to sports would probably be less tied to that sociopolitical crap I was talking about and more to the fact that so many African-Americans are so good at sports that it just naturally became a part of the larger culture. So, in that case, it would be not so much a matter of belief system leading to an attraction to sports. Rather, it would just be a belief system coinciding with a natural athletic inclination in the community.

Basically, I think it's Theory 3 by a country mile.

Pioli Zombie · 11-28-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SportsRacer

Godless liberal pinko commmie hippie socialists generally don't get their kids into sports as much as God-fearing patriotic flag-waving Americans. Sports are very closely tied to nationalism (see the Olympics) and in America, nationalism is very closely tied to religion. The same kind of people who endorsed Manifest Destiny back in the day are the same people who invest a lot of their time and energy in sports -- there's a drive, perhaps even a lust, for competitive achievement that seems to be inherent in American Christianity.

Conservatism and Christianity are practically synonymous in America these days, and what's more free market than the clearly defined winner/loser system of sports?

Also, I think your observations are correct: African-Americans are, in general, actually quite socially conservative and religious. But their attraction to sports would probably be less tied to that sociopolitical crap I was talking about and more to the fact that so many African-Americans are so good at sports that it just naturally became a part of the larger culture. So, in that case, it would be not so much a matter of belief system leading to an attraction to sports. Rather, it would just be a belief system coinciding with a natural athletic inclination in the community.

Basically, I think it's Theory 3 by a country mile.

Basically, you sound like a ****ing moron.
Posted via Mobile Device

Thig Lyfe · 11-28-2009, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pioli Zombie

Basically, you sound like a ****ing moron.
Posted via Mobile Device

CH13FS · 11-28-2009, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SportsRacer

Godless liberal pinko commmie hippie socialists generally don't get their kids into sports as much as God-fearing patriotic flag-waving Americans. Sports are very closely tied to nationalism (see the Olympics) and in America, nationalism is very closely tied to religion. The same kind of people who endorsed Manifest Destiny back in the day are the same people who invest a lot of their time and energy in sports -- there's a drive, perhaps even a lust, for competitive achievement that seems to be inherent in American Christianity.

Conservatism and Christianity are practically synonymous in America these days, and what's more free market than the clearly defined winner/loser system of sports?

Also, I think your observations are correct: African-Americans are, in general, actually quite socially conservative and religious. But their attraction to sports would probably be less tied to that sociopolitical crap I was talking about and more to the fact that so many African-Americans are so good at sports that it just naturally became a part of the larger culture. So, in that case, it would be not so much a matter of belief system leading to an attraction to sports. Rather, it would just be a belief system coinciding with a natural athletic inclination in the community.

Basically, I think it's Theory 3 by a country mile.

Basically, you are a genius master articulator.

Thig Lyfe · 11-28-2009, 02:39 PM

I guess there's some Theory 1 in there, too.

patteeu · 11-28-2009, 05:20 PM

I voted for theory 5. My theory is that there are only three types of people in the NFL. Those who take steroids. Criminals whose natural aggression and willingness to do bad things to other people works in their favor. And those for whom there's been some actual divine intervention who are naturally grateful to whatever god took an active interest in their lives.

I didn't really give my theory too much thought though so don't necessarily take it as gospel.

**chasedude** · 11-28-2009, 05:30 PM

George Carlin said it best about religion

http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm

Fairplay · 11-28-2009, 05:35 PM

I choose option E.

Dead&Buried · 11-28-2009, 05:35 PM

I always found it funny that people would owe their success to God, THUS saying that God wanted them to win and not the other team/individual.

IF there is a God he don't give a rats ass about any stupid football game.

Aries Walker · 11-28-2009, 07:35 PM

Option 4. The very religious just seem more prevalent in a football game because they have a forum and a reason to show their religion outwardly. Any group of people that size would have about the same numerical breakdown of the very religious and the very secular.

Consider your high school reunion. You go to the hotel ballroom or community fire hall or whatever, and you mix and mingle, and most conversation is of the how-are-you-doing, what-do-you-do-for-a-living, let's-see-your-kids variety. In that situation, it's not appropriate and wouldn't be obvious for (most of) the very religious to display their zeal. Put them in a competition, and give them a big television audience, and the very religious will show it by the way they celebrate their touchdowns.

Football games just seem more Bible-thumping because they have cameras turned on them.

JOhn · 11-28-2009, 07:39 PM

I'll vote soon, well just as soon as I figure out the poll. Damn Rainman you're taking this poll options to a new level.

View Poll Results: Football and Religion: A two-part question.
****Part 1. General Agreement/Disagreement (Check all that apply.)	1	5.88%
I agree with Theory 1.	3	17.65%
I agree with Theory 2.	1	5.88%
I agree with Theory 3.	4	23.53%
I agree with Theory 4.	7	41.18%
None of the above theories holds water.	1	5.88%
I'd like to propose another theory, which I'll call Theory 5.	2	11.76%
****Part 2. The theory I MOST agree with is... (Check ONLY one.)	1	5.88%
Theory 1.	2	11.76%
Theory 2.	2	11.76%
Theory 3.	3	17.65%
Theory 4.	7	41.18%
My own Theory 5.	3	17.65%
I disagree with everything. Everything	3	17.65%
I plan to write a long and obscure discourse on religion in this thread.	2	11.76%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 17. You may not vote on this poll

11-28-2009, 12:49 PM
Rain Man Seize life. Be an ermine. Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $-672449 VARSITY	Football and Religion A Reggie White discussion on another thread got me thinking about football and religion. I could be wrong, but it seems like football has a disproportional number of very religious people. Kurt Warner springs to mind, but you also have your Reggie Whites and Rod Woodsons and your Chiefs kickers pointing to the sky after every kick and lots and lots of players who are pretty sure that Jesus follows their team even when there's a local blackout. So it got me wondering. Are any or all of the following true? Theory 1. Religious Amplification. Players who reach the NFL have to realize that they've achieved the American Dream. Many of them are from more humble backgrounds or at least no greater than middle class. Do some of these players come to believe that there had to be a greater power or destiny involved in achieving great prosperity, which either amplified their religious beliefs or perhaps creates religious beliefs that may not have been there if they hadn't become successful? Theory 2. Religious Power. Players who reach the NFL must have enormous talent, but also enormous drive and faith in their ability. Are players with stronger religious beliefs more likely to achieve this success because they have religion as a support structure? Theory 3. Religious Demographics. Players who reach the NFL happen to come from families where religion is more common and more open for discussion. Southern players, African American players, etc. (I don't know if religion is more common and open among southerners and African Americans in my example. I just have that perception, and others can correct me or expound.) Theory 4. Flawed Observation. Theory 4 is that I'm wrong in my initial observation, and NFL players are not disproportionately religious. What do you think? I don't think these theories are independent of each other, so more than one could be true. Or there could be something else I'm not recognizing.
Posts: 145,503

11-28-2009, 01:42 PM	#2
Pioli Zombie Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: olathe,kansas Casino cash: $10004900	4 Flawed. Believers give the glory to God whether they achieve or not. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 11,077

11-28-2009, 01:53 PM	#3
SenselessChiefsFan MVP Join Date: Nov 2008 Casino cash: $10005450	The NFL is a cross section of society. It just so happens they have a much larger stage than the rest of us. Additionally, they are used to being accepted and don't feel much apprehension about sharing their faith.
Posts: 5,540

11-28-2009, 02:00 PM	#4
Psyko Tek special teams Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mesa AZ Casino cash: $10015665	everybody remember Bull Durham? when coster is coaching up Nuke, on how to give an interview? that's my theory __________________ Psyko Tek The keyboard has been drinking,
Posts: 12,018

11-28-2009, 02:09 PM	#5
Thig Lyfe Banned Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Thigpen's America Casino cash: $10004900	Godless liberal pinko commmie hippie socialists generally don't get their kids into sports as much as God-fearing patriotic flag-waving Americans. Sports are very closely tied to nationalism (see the Olympics) and in America, nationalism is very closely tied to religion. The same kind of people who endorsed Manifest Destiny back in the day are the same people who invest a lot of their time and energy in sports -- there's a drive, perhaps even a lust, for competitive achievement that seems to be inherent in American Christianity. Conservatism and Christianity are practically synonymous in America these days, and what's more free market than the clearly defined winner/loser system of sports? Also, I think your observations are correct: African-Americans are, in general, actually quite socially conservative and religious. But their attraction to sports would probably be less tied to that sociopolitical crap I was talking about and more to the fact that so many African-Americans are so good at sports that it just naturally became a part of the larger culture. So, in that case, it would be not so much a matter of belief system leading to an attraction to sports. Rather, it would just be a belief system coinciding with a natural athletic inclination in the community. Basically, I think it's Theory 3 by a country mile.
Posts: 25,680

11-28-2009, 02:39 PM	#9
Thig Lyfe Banned Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Thigpen's America Casino cash: $10004900	I guess there's some Theory 1 in there, too.
Posts: 25,680

11-28-2009, 05:20 PM	#10
patteeu The 23rd Pillar Join Date: Sep 2002 Casino cash: $10019237	I voted for theory 5. My theory is that there are only three types of people in the NFL. Those who take steroids. Criminals whose natural aggression and willingness to do bad things to other people works in their favor. And those for whom there's been some actual divine intervention who are naturally grateful to whatever god took an active interest in their lives. I didn't really give my theory too much thought though so don't necessarily take it as gospel. __________________ “Boy, you all want power. God, I hope you never get it.” - Lindsay Graham
Posts: 110,871

11-28-2009, 05:30 PM	#11
chasedude Supporter Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: St. Joe Casino cash: $9994900	George Carlin said it best about religion http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm
Posts: 36,287

11-28-2009, 05:35 PM	#12
Fairplay A certain set of skills Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: texas Casino cash: $10026683 VARSITY	I choose option E.
Posts: 25,265

11-28-2009, 05:35 PM	#13
Dead&Buried Starter Join Date: Oct 2009 Casino cash: $10004900	I always found it funny that people would owe their success to God, THUS saying that God wanted them to win and not the other team/individual. IF there is a God he don't give a rats ass about any stupid football game.
Posts: 37

11-28-2009, 07:35 PM	#14
Aries Walker Back again, again. Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: York, PA Casino cash: $9503357	Option 4. The very religious just seem more prevalent in a football game because they have a forum and a reason to show their religion outwardly. Any group of people that size would have about the same numerical breakdown of the very religious and the very secular. Consider your high school reunion. You go to the hotel ballroom or community fire hall or whatever, and you mix and mingle, and most conversation is of the how-are-you-doing, what-do-you-do-for-a-living, let's-see-your-kids variety. In that situation, it's not appropriate and wouldn't be obvious for (most of) the very religious to display their zeal. Put them in a competition, and give them a big television audience, and the very religious will show it by the way they celebrate their touchdowns. Football games just seem more Bible-thumping because they have cameras turned on them.
Posts: 8,213

11-28-2009, 07:39 PM	#15
JOhn El' Barto Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Cody, WY / Tucson AZ Casino cash: $9964900	I'll vote soon, well just as soon as I figure out the poll. Damn Rainman you're taking this poll options to a new level.
Posts: 25,529