Chiefs Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? - Page 7

**Tribal Warfare** · 12-20-2009, 11:17 PM

Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Loyalty? Fairness?

You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited.

On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs.

Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse.

It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory.

“When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns.

“When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch.

“When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium.

That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense.

It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray.

We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too.

You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates.

Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants.

Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat?

You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel.

Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands.

Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley?

What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach?

I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind.

Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver.

Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse.

I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.

**the Talking Can** · 12-21-2009, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

Well, hell yeah. I'd take Marty Schottenheimer back in an instant at this point.

it's crazy but i would too....

at least he'd leave us better than he found us....he'd get us organized

to the thread, i think there is 0 chance that pioli fires haley so....

SenselessChiefsFan · 12-21-2009, 06:36 AM

I am typically in favor of giving a coach three years to turn it around unless he loses the team.

I am fine with him being fired. I hope he is fired.

The_Doctor10 · 12-21-2009, 07:42 AM

A tale told by an idiot, signifying nothing...

memyselfI · 12-21-2009, 07:52 AM

Why?

The unemployment rate is already high enough.

He and his sideline antics provide entertainment value.

His nickname is 'the cleaner' because he cleared out the stadium providing opportunities for many non-season ticket holders to buy tickets.

Bottom line, I got nuthin.

suds79 · 12-21-2009, 08:12 AM

I just am having a hard time buying into the "You've got to give a HC X amount of time" argument when there's such huge upgrades out there.

You wouldn't do that from the player side would you?

I mean if Peyton Manning was somehow a FA, we wouldn't or shouldn't say ah we can't yank the starting job from Matt. He's only had one year.

That's what it's like for the HC class this year. Lots of proven SB talent out there.

Forget what's fair. Just try to upgrade the team as much as possible. Players & coaches.

burt · 12-21-2009, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedThat

I personally don't agree with how Haley calls a game, or how he manages and handles his team.

But I will say this, he's a rookie head coach, and was given a crappy roster from the start. Im not trying to stick up for the guy, all Im trying to say is, it would be hard for most coaches to thrive under those circumstances.

THis

Deberg_1990 · 12-21-2009, 08:43 AM

I'm just scared haley won't change, or is just too stubborn to change. Why take that chance? Cut your losses and move on clark and scott....
Posted via Mobile Device

burt · 12-21-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedThat

I personally don't agree with how Haley calls a game, or how he manages and handles his team.

But I will say this, he's a rookie head coach, and was given a crappy roster from the start. Im not trying to stick up for the guy, all Im trying to say is, it would be hard for most coaches to thrive under those circumstances.

and THIS

Dayze · 12-21-2009, 08:52 AM

I wonder if Clark k nows we lost the game.

Chiefnj2 · 12-21-2009, 08:56 AM

I think the best thing that can happen at this point is for Pioli to sit down with Haley and tell him: (a) he needs to hire a competent OC, (b) he needs to hire a competent QB coach, (c) he's going to treat his coaches with respect and remember they are adults and likely have more coaching experience than he has, and (d) tell him he better be very careful with his hires because they will stay the course with whoever he chooses.

I just think the option of gutting things again at this point will set the team back another 3-4 years. You can't have three separate rebuilds and three different systems over 3 years.

Red Dawg · 12-21-2009, 09:00 AM

This article was stupid. Coaches are not on the field. Players win games. Give Haley better players and the team will win. His offense in AZ scored alot of points so get him the WR's to run it and we'll be fine. Clancy I don't like, I hope they go get Romey, but he doesn't have good players either.

No coach in the NFL is such a bad teacher that a team would be this bad just because they are the coach. WE NEED GOOD PLAYERS!

Deberg_1990 · 12-21-2009, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

I think the best thing that can happen at this point is for Pioli to sit down with Haley and tell him: (a) he needs to hire a competent OC, (b) he needs to hire a competent QB coach, (c) he's going to treat his coaches with respect and remember they are adults and likely have more coaching experience than he has, and (d) tell him he better be very careful with his hires because they will stay the course with whoever he chooses.

I just think the option of gutting things again at this point will set the team back another 3-4 years. You can't have three separate rebuilds and three different systems over 3 years.

This is my argument...how does it set us back 3-4 years? We are already at rock bottom. Haley hasn't improved one area of the team. Not one. There is no justification to keep this turd. We are in the exact same position we were in last year at this time.
Posted via Mobile Device

**DeezNutz** · 12-21-2009, 09:11 AM

Eddie Kinnison on 810:

"The Chiefs are already on vacation. Todd Haley lost those guys in...maybe...February."

Chiefnj2 · 12-21-2009, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

This is my argument...how does it set us back 3-4 years? We are already at rock bottom. Haley hasn't improved one area of the team. Not one. There is no justification to keep this turd. We are in the exact same position we were in last year at this time.
Posted via Mobile Device

You are going to sacrifice another draft class (no matter how bad you think it is/was) and put in new schemes for the third time in three years? Plus, look at teams that are continually changing coaches and coordinators - they aren't good. Sadly, I think it's better to stick with what they have to see if they can make it work.

CHIEFS58 · 12-21-2009, 09:33 AM

i swear hes just a darker version of peter king. useless.

12-20-2009, 11:17 PM
Tribal Warfare Man of Culture Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Far Beyond Comprehension Casino cash: $-2997187	Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? By JASON WHITLOCK The Kansas City Star I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Loyalty? Fairness? You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited. On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs. Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse. It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory. “When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns. “When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch. “When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium. That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense. It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray. We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too. You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates. Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants. Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat? You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel. Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands. Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley? What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach? I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind. Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver. Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse. I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.
Posts: 43,454

12-21-2009, 06:36 AM	#92
SenselessChiefsFan MVP Join Date: Nov 2008 Casino cash: $10005450	I am typically in favor of giving a coach three years to turn it around unless he loses the team. I am fine with him being fired. I hope he is fired.
Posts: 5,540

12-21-2009, 07:42 AM	#93
The_Doctor10 Everyone else is 'peasants' Join Date: Nov 2008 Casino cash: $9914900	A tale told by an idiot, signifying nothing... __________________ Fly Eagles Fly Patrick Mahomes has a losing record in Super Bowls that Kyle Shanahan is not the opposing HC. Tom Brady still the GOAT.
Posts: 1,532

12-21-2009, 07:52 AM	#94
memyselfI CHANGEd your mind yet???? Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Lunatics Anonymous Casino cash: $10005234	Why? The unemployment rate is already high enough. He and his sideline antics provide entertainment value. His nickname is 'the cleaner' because he cleared out the stadium providing opportunities for many non-season ticket holders to buy tickets. Bottom line, I got nuthin. __________________ Meet the new boss same as the old boss. BigChiefDave:"Anyone who thought we would only be in Iraq for a few years is either stoned or just stoopid." "It is unknowable how long that conflict will last. It could last 6 days, 6 wks. I doubt 6 mths." Rummy 2/7/03
Posts: 32,000

12-21-2009, 08:12 AM	#95
suds79 MVP Join Date: Sep 2000 Casino cash: $10005036	I just am having a hard time buying into the "You've got to give a HC X amount of time" argument when there's such huge upgrades out there. You wouldn't do that from the player side would you? I mean if Peyton Manning was somehow a FA, we wouldn't or shouldn't say ah we can't yank the starting job from Matt. He's only had one year. That's what it's like for the HC class this year. Lots of proven SB talent out there. Forget what's fair. Just try to upgrade the team as much as possible. Players & coaches.
Posts: 5,747

12-21-2009, 08:43 AM	#97
Deberg_1990 In Search of a Life Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio Tx. Casino cash: $104454	I'm just scared haley won't change, or is just too stubborn to change. Why take that chance? Cut your losses and move on clark and scott.... Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 68,677

12-21-2009, 08:52 AM	#99
Dayze Resident Glue Sniffer Join Date: Nov 2003 Casino cash: $1739358	I wonder if Clark k nows we lost the game. __________________ Life is 99% inspiration, 1% Perspiration, and 1% Attention to Detial. RIP & Godspeed: Saccoppo Lonewolf Ed Fire Me Boy
Posts: 37,460

12-21-2009, 08:56 AM	#100
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $6654388	I think the best thing that can happen at this point is for Pioli to sit down with Haley and tell him: (a) he needs to hire a competent OC, (b) he needs to hire a competent QB coach, (c) he's going to treat his coaches with respect and remember they are adults and likely have more coaching experience than he has, and (d) tell him he better be very careful with his hires because they will stay the course with whoever he chooses. I just think the option of gutting things again at this point will set the team back another 3-4 years. You can't have three separate rebuilds and three different systems over 3 years. __________________ Mismanaging the clock.
Posts: 22,541

12-21-2009, 09:00 AM	#101
Red Dawg Going home eventually Join Date: Dec 2002 Casino cash: $1232858	This article was stupid. Coaches are not on the field. Players win games. Give Haley better players and the team will win. His offense in AZ scored alot of points so get him the WR's to run it and we'll be fine. Clancy I don't like, I hope they go get Romey, but he doesn't have good players either. No coach in the NFL is such a bad teacher that a team would be this bad just because they are the coach. WE NEED GOOD PLAYERS! __________________ If you're not first you're last!
Posts: 33,173

12-21-2009, 09:33 AM	#105
CHIEFS58 Smoke a turd. Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Western North Carolina Casino cash: $10004930	i swear hes just a darker version of peter king. useless.
Posts: 2,217