Arguments for a Left Tackle in the 2010 Draft.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

You don't like Long, who, as of last season, was one of the top three left tackles in the NFL, but you're completely happy with Brandon Albert's performance from the past two seasons?

Pay the **** attention, dipshit.

I've said numerous times that Albert struggled.
I never once said that I was completely happy with Albert's performance.

All I've ever said is that he's a kid that is his second year, just learning technque, whose had to go through three scheme changes (four, when you consider the change to a spread last year after Thogpen took over the starting dutoes at QB), whose battled through injuries in his first season, and struggled with a substantial weight loss in a short peiod of time.

And with all of that, I still like his potential, and I don't believe you give up on that potential after only his second year.

And no, I don't like Jake Long, because he will never be a guy with the feet to handle speed rushers on an island.
He's always going to need help.

You may not like the idea of a team taking an offensive lineman early - know that how some people are in terms of how they look at the draft. But the position is key in terms of building a better functioning team wherever/however those players are acquired, whether it be on the premiere left tackle in the draft of an undrafted free agent that slips through the cracks.

JFC, I never said I don't like the idea of taking OL early in the draft, if that OL is a LT with potential to be an elite LT in the NFL.
I don't believe that is Okung.

And you are wrong about Okung's feet. His footwork is very good and his foot speed is also very good. His feet are always moving to make sure that his center of balance and power are situated on a vertical centerline like you want from a top flight left tackle.

Yeah.
I'm wrong, and so is everyone else apparently, because that is one question that is raised by almost everyone.

But you're the only one with the vision to recognize that everyone is wrong.

You want to see bad feet? Here's some bad feet, and on a guy who some people think would be great as our high second rounder:



You know who that reminds me of? Yep, Albert. Tries to use his power and bulk versus using his feet to work guys out and around. Reaches and lunges and pushes versus utilizing leverage and foot work.

Wow, imagine that, a college guard that some think has the athletic ability to play tackle being compared to a college guard that most thought had the athletic ability to make that transition.

Why, I just bet college guards practice OT technique non stop.

Hell, Okung's footwork is substantially better than Bulaga's as well. It's not even close:



I'd put up Davis and Campbell vids, but they make Bulaga's footwork look good in comparison.

The only guy that is close to Okung in terms of a legitimate left tackle is this dude, and he's got issues of getting overwhelmed when they go straight at him.



Comparatively, Okung is closer to Joe Thomas than he is Jake Long. The guy that is like Jake Long is Jason Fox out of Miami. I agree with Mecca that Brown is similar to D'brickashaw Ferguson but needs to up his mass/strength.

You may not like the pick for the Chiefs because you are holding out hope that Albert finally clicks all the parts together or that you just don't think that it's necessary to take an offensive tackle that early in the draft, but it's pretty obvious that Okung is the best left tackle propect in this draft.

If it's so ****ing obvious, why is that even sites that you've used to support your whole Okung love affair question whether he's the best prospect.

JFC, why I am wasting keystrokes on your dumb ass?

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by milkman

Pay the **** attention, dipshit.

I really don't think that the word "****" is appropriate as a noun determiner in that sentence.

I've said numerous times that Albert struggled.
I never once said that I was completely happy with Albert's performance.

All I've ever said is that he's a kid that is his second year, just learning technque, whose had to go through three scheme changes (four, when you consider the change to a spread last year after Thogpen took over the starting dutoes at QB), whose battled through injuries in his first season, and struggled with a substantial weight loss in a short peiod of time.

And with all of that, I still like his potential, and I don't believe you give up on that potential after only his second year.

Insert Matt Cassel, Rudy Niswanger, DaJuan Morgan, Dwayne Bowe, Maurice Leggett, Tyson Jackson and Glenn Dorsey for "Albert" in the above and you have the Chiefs current situation.

JFC, I never said I don't like the idea of taking OL early in the draft, if that OL is a LT with potential to be an elite LT in the NFL.
I don't believe that is Okung.

The point I'm trying to make is that there isn't anyone in this draft other than Suh who you can say that about from a position perspective. There is always going to be questions about a person/player. Hell, the teams in the league were pretty much split on who was going to be the better quarterback - Manning or Leaf. You think Albert is going to turn the corner and become a viable left tackle. I don't see him being anything more than mediocre at that position. Just a difference of opinions. You don't have to get so worked up about it.

Wow, imagine that, a college guard that some think has the athletic ability to play tackle being compared to a college guard that most thought had the athletic ability to make that transition.

Why, I just bet college guards practice OT technique non stop.

That's my point. Albert was a project when he was drafted two years ago. There was no guarantee that he was going to end up as a competent left tackle because he never played the position. It was a reach pick by Carl/Herm for a team that needed players who had to contribute right then and there. If they had a top flight LT that was heading into the twilight of his professional career and wanted him to learn the position under the guy or groom him at RT with the hope of moving him over, then he would have been a decent pick. But they needed a LT immediately, threw him to the wolves and he's struggled.

If it's so ****ing obvious, why is that even sites that you've used to support your whole Okung love affair question whether he's the best prospect.

Because draftniks love "potential." They love talking up Herculean type guys like Campbell and Iupati for the LT spot (*cough*Robert Gallery*cough*) because they look the part. They love combine numbers, the bench press and the 40. Because they don't take into account teams schemes and the types of players that would work best in those schemes but rather how much potential a guys has based on his raw physical attributes.

JFC, why I am wasting keystrokes on your dumb ass?

I don't know. Maybe you don't have anything better to do. I've got to go make some deviled eggs, so I'll have to excuse myself from this conversation for a bit.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

I really don't think that the word "****" is appropriate as a noun determiner in that sentence.

Like I really give a rat's ass when and where **** is appropriately used.

Insert Matt Cassel, Rudy Niswanger, DaJuan Morgan, Dwayne Bowe, Maurice Leggett, Tyson Jackson and Glenn Dorsey for "Albert" in the above and you have the Chiefs current situation.

No, you can't say the same about any of those guys.
Cassel has played QB for years.
Niswanger has played Center for years.
Legget, corner, years.

Jackson and Dorsey converting to 34 ends are as close to Albert in terms of transitioning, but still haven't gone through the same number of changes that Albert has been through.

The point I'm trying to make is that there isn't anyone in this draft other than Suh who you can say that about from a position perspective. There is always going to be questions about a person/player. Hell, the teams in the league were pretty much split on who was going to be the better quarterback - Manning or Leaf. You think Albert is going to turn the corner and become a viable left tackle. I don't see him being anything more than mediocre at that position. Just a difference of opinions. You don't have to get so worked up about it.

Your point fails, cause when it comes to foot speed, that, or lack thereof, is the biggest red flag for a potential LT.

That's my point. Albert was a project when he was drafted two years ago. There was no guarantee that he was going to end up as a competent left tackle because he never played the position. It was a reach pick by Carl/Herm for a team that needed players who had to contribute right then and there. If they had a top flight LT that was heading into the twilight of his professional career and wanted him to learn the position under the guy or groom him at RT with the hope of moving him over, then he would have been a decent pick. But they needed a LT immediately, threw him to the wolves and he's struggled.

Fail again.
When Albert was drafted, this team was making a commitement to rebuilding, and they didn't need players who could come in and contribute right away.
They needed guys with potential to become the core group in three years, and Albert's potential and athletic ability was exactly the type to fill that bill.

Because draftniks love "potential." They love talking up Herculean type guys like Campbell and Iupati for the LT spot (*cough*Robert Gallery*cough*) because they look the part. They love combine numbers, the bench press and the 40. Because they don't take into account teams schemes and the types of players that would work best in those schemes but rather how much potential a guys has based on his raw physical attributes.

No, they are questioning Okung's potential because of a lack of foot speed.

I don't know. Maybe you don't have anything better to do. I've got to go make some deviled eggs, so I'll have to excuse myself from this conversation for a bit.

That was a rhetorical question, because in fact, the reason I waste keystokes is because, as Deetznuts so brilliantly stated, I feel it's my duty to bludgeon dumbassery.

And you, my friend, require a sound bludgeoning.

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by milkman

Cassel has played QB for years.

Well, kinda. He's been a QB for years. Played? Not so much.

Thanks, Scott!

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by milkman

Cassel has played QB for years.
Niswanger has played Center for years.
Legget, corner, years.

Cassel has played for two years.
Niswanger has been in the league for four years and started for two.
Legget was part of the same draft as Dorsey and Albert.

Jackson and Dorsey converting to 34 ends are as close to Albert in terms of transitioning, but still haven't gone through the same number of changes that Albert has been through.

Your point fails, cause when it comes to foot speed, that, or lack thereof, is the biggest red flag for a potential LT.

And that's why I put up those vids, so you can take a look at his foot speed. Looked pretty good, especially compared to other top tackles in this draft. But I'd hate to have you form your own opinion versus reading a mock draft site...

When Albert was drafted, this team was making a commitement to rebuilding, and they didn't need players who could come in and contribute right away.
They needed guys with potential to become the core group in three years, and Albert's potential and athletic ability was exactly the type to fill that bill.

I'm glad you had/have such a high opinion of McIntosh. So, what you are saying is that he's got one more year to reach that potential of a first round, franchise left tackle? And then what? Say he performs to the exact same level in 2010 that he did in 2009 - what's your viewpoint of the position then? Do we go after the top tackle next year, which looks to be Barksdale? I mean, next years line class is going to be pretty damn weak. Are you hoping that we'll find some diamond in the rough this year? Next year? Would you be happy with the Chiefs soldiering on with mediocrity at the LT spot for the next decade?

No, they are questioning Okung's potential because of a lack of foot speed.

Who is? He had better footwork than Davis, Bulaga, Iupati, Campbell and looked even better than Brown. I don't have zeroed in game evaluation tapes, but he looked substantially better than the other guys people are touting as top tackles.

I feel it's my duty to bludgeon dumbassery.

You've got to be a major masochist.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Cassel has played for two years.
Niswanger has been in the league for four years and started for two.
Legget was part of the same draft as Dorsey and Albert.

Jackson and Dorsey converting to 34 ends are as close to Albert in terms of transitioning, but still haven't gone through the same number of changes that Albert has been through.

Don't be dense, dumbshit.

Whether they actually started and played in games, they have been working at their respective positions since high school, for the most part, and to play that card is disingenuous, at best.

And that's why I put up those vids, so you can take a look at his foot speed. Looked pretty good, especially compared to other top tackles in this draft. But I'd hate to have you form your own opinion versus reading a mock draft site...

I've seen Okung, and formed my own opinion.

He doesn't have elite foot speed, and looks like a RT on the next level.

I'm glad you had/have such a high opinion of McIntosh. So, what you are saying is that he's got one more year to reach that potential of a first round, franchise left tackle? And then what? Say he performs to the exact same level in 2010 that he did in 2009 - what's your viewpoint of the position then? Do we go after the top tackle next year, which looks to be Barksdale? I mean, next years line class is going to be pretty damn weak. Are you hoping that we'll find some diamond in the rough this year? Next year? Would you be happy with the Chiefs soldiering on with mediocrity at the LT spot for the next decade?

JFC.

The fact that we were in rebuilding mode means that we didn't need Albert to be all pro overnight, and has not a ****ing thing to do with my opinion of McIntosh.

If Albert doesn't improve, we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.
But for now, I'm prepared to move forward with Albert.

Who is? He had better footwork than Davis, Bulaga, Iupati, Campbell and looked even better than Brown. I don't have zeroed in game evaluation tapes, but he looked substantially better than the other guys people are touting as top tackles.

You provided the link where it was suggested that others might be better prospects because of foot speed.

Go read your own damn links.

You've got to be a major masochist.

Perhaps.