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Old 10-04-2010, 03:07 PM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Even while McCluster succeeds, this continues to be my concern about that pick...
He is a gadget guy, yes. Who can provide tons of different things for your offense. And he's someone who can contribute immediately.

But is he someone you can build around?

I hesitate still, even now, to say yes.

What's the track record of really small football players in the NFL?

Don't they typically peter out after a few years? Even if they are very good -- as Sproles, a thicker back than McCluster, was very good -- won't they eventually flame out in a few years, rather than providing the sustained level of ability that virtually any other position on the football field would?

I am prepared to endure your scorn.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:09 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
He is a gadget guy, yes. Who can provide tons of different things for your offense. And he's someone who can contribute immediately.

But is he someone you can build around?

I hesitate still, even now, to say yes.

What's the track record of really small football players in the NFL?

Don't they typically peter out after a few years? Even if they are very good -- as Sproles, a thicker back than McCluster, was very good -- won't they eventually flame out in a few years, rather than providing the sustained level of ability that virtually any other position on the football field would?

I am prepared to endure your scorn.
I think you want to suck Clausens dick that is why? Because we drafted Mccluster over him. That is what this is really about your stupid love crush with Clausen. What you do with Clausen behind doors is your business, but whacking it to him and throwing Mccluster under the bus because you wanted him. Means one thing first off that is why you aren't making decisions and Pioli is. Second off let it go omg Mccluster was an amazing pick and Clausen will just be another average QB! That is just my 2 cents!
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:09 PM   #32
chiefzilla1501 chiefzilla1501 is offline
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
He is a gadget guy, yes. Who can provide tons of different things for your offense. And he's someone who can contribute immediately.

But is he someone you can build around?

I hesitate still, even now, to say yes.
Yes, he is. He's got the right character to fit into a culture that is clearly committed to playing your ass of and win, and while he may not be a guy to build off of in some offenses, he's most certainly one you can build off of in Charlie Weis' offense.



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What's the track record of really small football players in the NFL?
Warrick Dunn, Desean Jackson, Percy Harvin, Wes Welker, Dante Hall. You can argue all you want about body frame, but in terms of pounds when you factor in the extra inch or 2 or 3 of height, you're talking a difference of only a few pounds.


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Don't they typically peter out after a few years? Even if they are very good -- as Sproles, a thicker back than McCluster, was very good -- won't they eventually flame out in a few years, rather than providing the sustained level of ability that virtually any other position on the football field would?

I am prepared to endure your scorn.
I don't think it's appropriate to compare the two at this point. McCluster has only had a handful of carries. Sproles has more than a handful of carries in his career and the thing you worry about most with a small player is their ability to take on the constant grinding toward the line of scrimmage. If their job is to play in space, they're a lot less susceptible to injury.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:12 PM   #33
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Um... sorry...not concerned anymore.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:12 PM   #34
Kyle DeLexus Kyle DeLexus is offline
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Who do you get in the 2nd to "build around?"
#24?
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:13 PM   #35
Pitt Gorilla Pitt Gorilla is offline
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Drew Brees... Wait, I shouldn't have said that.
Yeah, and every 6th rounder should be Tom Brady.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:13 PM   #36
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I don't want to get this thread off on a tangent, because I at least partially agree with it, but did anyone watch for Terrence Cody this week? He was supposed to be active for the first time this week but doesn't show up on the stat sheet. Did anybody watch that game and see him play?
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:15 PM   #37
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Yeah, and every 6th rounder should be Tom Brady.
Because this is analogous to the 36th overall pick. Yes, you should be able to get a foundational player at this point in the draft.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:16 PM   #38
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The pick that should be questioned is Javier Arenas.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:19 PM   #39
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Picks like McCluster are a coup if you are a GM, because you get a guy who will be pretty much as good as he'll ever be right away. Most people are rightfully tired of losing, but we seem to be getting to the point (like arguing over the fact that you can win with a game manager) that we're willing to take shortcuts.

That's how you end up in purgatory.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:20 PM   #40
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No one builds around a WR. They added a playmaker which they DESPERATELY needed.

Next draft? Back to the grind to get a deep-threat WR with size, a NT and OLB. Can't fix it all in 1 draft.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:23 PM   #41
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They picked Moeaki becuase in the NFL size=no injuries
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:26 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Picks like McCluster are a coup if you are a GM, because you get a guy who will be pretty much as good as he'll ever be right away. Most people are rightfully tired of losing, but we seem to be getting to the point (like arguing over the fact that you can win with a game manager) that we're willing to take shortcuts.

That's how you end up in purgatory.
There are lots of positions that don't take overly long to develop. Inside Linebacker, Guard, Tight End, arguably Free Safety.

I don't think it's accurate at all to say McCluster is anywhere near his peak. He played most of his snaps as a RB. He still has a crazy amount of upside as he gets better at route running and recognition in the passing game.

If the Chiefs were interested in taking shortcuts, they would have spent a boatload of money on players like Julius Peppers and drafted for need instead of "role players." The fact that the Chiefs took two role players in spite of what we thought were glaring positions of need, to me, indicates that they are a lot more interested in a patient approach to building this team.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:29 PM   #43
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Because this is analogous to the 36th overall pick. Yes, you should be able to get a foundational player at this point in the draft.
An average about 5 second rounders become pro bowlers.

The idea that we should be able to get a foundational player in the second round, especially when you're talking about positions of high positional value, is completely overstated. Most hits have come from either picking conservatively (Guard, Running Back, Right Tackle, Tight End) or getting lucky by stealing a CB, QB, WR, etc... who ended up being underrated.

Most picks around McCluster and Arenas are going to bust and bust hard. Probably around 1/2 to 3/4 of them.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:30 PM   #44
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Picks like McCluster are a coup if you are a GM, because you get a guy who will be pretty much as good as he'll ever be right away. Most people are rightfully tired of losing, but we seem to be getting to the point (like arguing over the fact that you can win with a game manager) that we're willing to take shortcuts.

That's how you end up in purgatory.
That's what this draft seems like. It all seems like a shortcut.

We need long-term solutions at some pretty critical positions that take a while to develop: passrushing, nose tackle, receiving, even QB.

But the 2010 draft wasn't about development, it was "what can you do for me now?"

The biggest reason why I liked the 2009 draft out of the gate more than the 2010 draft is because it was far more foundational. The 2008 draft was orgasmic.

The 2010 draft isn't as foundational, if it can be called foundational at all.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:31 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
There are lots of positions that don't take overly long to develop. Inside Linebacker, Guard, Tight End, arguably Free Safety.

I don't think it's accurate at all to say McCluster is anywhere near his peak. He played most of his snaps as a RB. He still has a crazy amount of upside as he gets better at route running and recognition in the passing game.

If the Chiefs were interested in taking shortcuts, they would have spent a boatload of money on players like Julius Peppers and drafted for need instead of "role players." The fact that the Chiefs took two role players in spite of what we thought were glaring positions of need, to me, indicates that they are a lot more interested in a patient approach to building this team.
This is a fair argument.
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