The biggest reason our offense was great was the O-Line, Herm didn't ruin it. - Page 2

Red Dawg · 12-20-2006, 07:04 AM

Herm has not ruined our offense. We don't have a dominate line anymore which has led to less yardage in the air and on the ground. Couple that with mediocre WR's and a suspect FB and this is what you get.

Trent is looking old as well. His arm no longer has the power to go down field. How many throws have hit the ground. How many times against Balt did they run up and knock the ball away from our WR's. We've seen Trnet under throw our guys more than once this year on deep patterns. This is related to arm strength.

Herm deserves a chance to build his team. Get the O-line he wants and get larger more physical WR's that can get the ball without having to be wide open.

At least we know damn well he will get some more beef for the D-line.

FD · 12-20-2006, 10:16 AM

I agree completely. While all the emphasis in the media are on the stars and "skill" positions, football games are won and lost on the line of scrimmage, and thats where we need to focus.

Silock · 12-20-2006, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Carl and Herm sit and did nothing thinking Willie was coming back!

What were they supposed to do? Roaf announced shortly before training camp, and they thought Svitek was going to be his backup, with Sampson and Black at RT.

There wasn't really anything they could do.

Deberg_1990 · 12-20-2006, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj

I wonder if Herm will realize that he needs a better OL and if he will address it.

In his 5 years in New York the Jets did not use a single first day draft pick at the OL position. This year, Mangini's first year, they used both on the OL (Brick and Mangold) and it appears to have paid dividends.

But yet they always ran the ball well with Curtis Martin. Didnt he lead the league in rushing like 2 or 3 years ago??

Pennington also had a couple of good years when he wasnt injured.

The Jets had a decent line.

htismaqe · 12-20-2006, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj

I wonder if Herm will realize that he needs a better OL and if he will address it.

In his 5 years in New York the Jets did not use a single first day draft pick at the OL position. This year, Mangini's first year, they used both on the OL (Brick and Mangold) and it appears to have paid dividends.

He drafted Kareem McKenzie in the 3rd round in 2001.

And you conveniently left out that in the 5 seasons prior to Herm's arrival, the Jets drafted Jason Fabini, Randy Thomas, and Matt O'Dwyer and acquired Kevin Mawae.

StcChief · 12-20-2006, 10:31 AM

Herm is working with an aging OLine.

He will get some good replacements at OG, LT, WR, DT

I have confidence.

Silock · 12-20-2006, 10:32 AM

We don't need a new LT. We need a new RT.

htismaqe · 12-20-2006, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silock

We don't need a new LT. We need a new RT.

You can't be serious.

Reerun_KC · 12-20-2006, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silock

What were they supposed to do? Roaf announced shortly before training camp, and they thought Svitek was going to be his backup, with Sampson and Black at RT.

There wasn't really anything they could do.

yes there was, from what everyone was saying Roaf turned his paper work in way before that and they had a pretty good idea that he wasnt coming back anyway.

On top of the Carl knew that Roaf was damaged goods anyway, why not play damamge control and try to resolve the situation earlier, by FA or draft.

Nope, that would of been the right thing to do.

If Herm had any balls between his legs, he would of went to Carl and said, Get me a good LT, so we dont have to worry about the grounds keepers digging up our QB's on a regular basis after they are repeatedly planted.

Agian like I said in a different thread. Herm was a safe hire, and these are the reasons why. No conflict, will do what Carl tells him to do with out any question.

Reerun_KC · 12-20-2006, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe

He drafted Kareem McKenzie in the 3rd round in 2001.

And you conveniently left out that in the 5 seasons prior to Herm's arrival, the Jets drafted Jason Fabini, Randy Thomas, and Matt O'Dwyer and acquired Kevin Mawae.

The Big Tuna wouldnt of had anything to do with that would he? He was the Jets HC before the Bill guy shafted them and went to NE right?

My thought was Herm always won with Parcells players and when that cupboard ran dry. Herm then proceeded to tank the organization. And yes this was before he came here to KC....

acasas4 · 12-20-2006, 10:47 AM

Granted the line isn't what it has been in the past but the play calling is not working. When you're constantly getting into third and long because you run the ball on 1st and 2nd downs the opposing defense is going to bring it on 3rd down because they know you have to throw. Play action more on 1st down, trick plays, hell do something that isn't so predictable. Don't keep trying to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result.

FloridaMan88 · 12-20-2006, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

Herm has not ruined our offense. We don't have a dominate line anymore which has led to less yardage in the air and on the ground. Couple that with mediocre WR's and a suspect FB and this is what you get.

Trent is looking old as well. His arm no longer has the power to go down field. How many throws have hit the ground. How many times against Balt did they run up and knock the ball away from our WR's. We've seen Trnet under throw our guys more than once this year on deep patterns. This is related to arm strength.

Herm deserves a chance to build his team. Get the O-line he wants and get larger more physical WR's that can get the ball without having to be wide open.

At least we know damn well he will get some more beef for the D-line.

Well if are so-called "genius" of a GM that too many people on this board STILL feel the urge to defend wouldn't have neglected the offense these past few offseasons and would have been proactive in ensuring that it maintained its spot as one of the best offenses in the league... the Chiefs wouldn't be in the current dire situation they are now in on offense.

But typical Carl Peterson, he let the problem blow up in his face before taking action.

htismaqe · 12-20-2006, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

The Big Tuna wouldnt of had anything to do with that would he? He was the Jets HC before the Bill guy shafted them and went to NE right?

My thought was Herm always won with Parcells players and when that cupboard ran dry. Herm then proceeded to tank the organization. And yes this was before he came here to KC....

Whatever.

It's pretty simple. Herm didn't draft offensive linemen in New York because he really didn't need to.

That would be like Herm now going to the Raiders and them needing a RB and bitching because Herm didn't draft one in KC.

Seriously, some of your criticisms of Herm are downright reeruned.

Archie Bunker · 12-20-2006, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

The Big Tuna wouldnt of had anything to do with that would he? He was the Jets HC before the Bill guy shafted them and went to NE right?

My thought was Herm always won with Parcells players and when that cupboard ran dry. Herm then proceeded to tank the organization. And yes this was before he came here to KC....

Al Groh was there for 1 year between Parcells and Herm. I see nothing wrong with what Herm did in NY. He took them to the playoffs 3 out of 5 years, won a couple of playoff games, had a bad year in which everyone got hurt, and now a team filled with his draft picks and FAs are challenging for a playoff spot.

Silock · 12-20-2006, 10:56 AM

What, exactly, has Black done wrong this year at LT? When opponents get pressure, it was mainly coming from a collapsed right side of the line. No, Black isn't Roaf, but who is? He wasn't very good at RT, but RT and LT are two different positions. They're not mirror images of each other just because they're on opposite sides of the line. His problem have been because he was moved around so much, in my opinion. He's settling in to his natural position and it's working right now.

Silock · 12-20-2006, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

yes there was, from what everyone was saying Roaf turned his paper work in way before that and they had a pretty good idea that he wasnt coming back anyway.

Speculation.

Quote:

If Herm had any balls between his legs, he would of went to Carl and said, Get me a good LT, so we dont have to worry about the grounds keepers digging up our QB's on a regular basis after they are repeatedly planted.

Preposterous. Who would they be able to get? I want some names.

12-20-2006, 07:04 AM
Red Dawg Going home eventually Join Date: Dec 2002 Casino cash: $1232858	The biggest reason our offense was great was the O-Line, Herm didn't ruin it. Herm has not ruined our offense. We don't have a dominate line anymore which has led to less yardage in the air and on the ground. Couple that with mediocre WR's and a suspect FB and this is what you get. Trent is looking old as well. His arm no longer has the power to go down field. How many throws have hit the ground. How many times against Balt did they run up and knock the ball away from our WR's. We've seen Trnet under throw our guys more than once this year on deep patterns. This is related to arm strength. Herm deserves a chance to build his team. Get the O-line he wants and get larger more physical WR's that can get the ball without having to be wide open. At least we know damn well he will get some more beef for the D-line.
Posts: 33,173

12-20-2006, 10:16 AM	#16
FD Veteran Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Indiana Casino cash: $9372813	I agree completely. While all the emphasis in the media are on the stars and "skill" positions, football games are won and lost on the line of scrimmage, and thats where we need to focus.
Posts: 4,440

12-20-2006, 10:31 AM	#20
StcChief Playing for #1 Draft Pick Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Just West of Lambs land Casino cash: $10004900	Herm is working with an aging OLine. He will get some good replacements at OG, LT, WR, DT I have confidence. __________________ sig test for this screwy schema
Posts: 25,901

12-20-2006, 10:32 AM	#21
Silock MVP Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Overland Park Casino cash: $10020882	We don't need a new LT. We need a new RT.
Posts: 19,908

12-20-2006, 10:47 AM	#25
acasas4 Starter Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Independence Casino cash: $9935265	Granted the line isn't what it has been in the past but the play calling is not working. When you're constantly getting into third and long because you run the ball on 1st and 2nd downs the opposing defense is going to bring it on 3rd down because they know you have to throw. Play action more on 1st down, trick plays, hell do something that isn't so predictable. Don't keep trying to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result. __________________ Now I'm ready for some football!
Posts: 474

12-20-2006, 10:56 AM	#29
Silock MVP Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Overland Park Casino cash: $10020882	What, exactly, has Black done wrong this year at LT? When opponents get pressure, it was mainly coming from a collapsed right side of the line. No, Black isn't Roaf, but who is? He wasn't very good at RT, but RT and LT are two different positions. They're not mirror images of each other just because they're on opposite sides of the line. His problem have been because he was moved around so much, in my opinion. He's settling in to his natural position and it's working right now.
Posts: 19,908