Cassel VS Orton

[RustShack]

Orton in his two years in our offense-

62.1% 3,802 yards 21 TD 12 INT 86.8 Rating 7.0 YPA
58.8% 3,653 yards 20 TD 9 INT 87.5 Rating 7.3 YPA

Cassel those same last two years in the same system with better cast-

55.0% 2,924 yards 16 TD 16 INT 69.9 Rating 5.93 YPA
58.2% 3,116 yards 27 TD 7 INT 93.0 Rating 6.92 YPA

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by MagicHef

It's hilarious how many people think that switching from a QB that leads the league in turnovers to one that has had 2 in 5 games has nothing to do with the defense suddenly playing better. Also, a better running game (which Tebow has nothing to do with) certainly doesn't help the defense either.

Or that a new coach might take more than a few games to adjust to. Both on offense and defense. Especially given a shortened preseason.

[listopencil]

Originally Posted by RustShack

I wonder exactly how similar McDouches offense is to ours.. They have the same original base, but obviously coaches add their own tweaks to it. If theres a lot of the same terminology, he could step in pretty soon and start.

E-P is very dynamic. You can really do anything with it, adjust it to where your strengths are. I'd say there is a very good possibility that Orton just needs to develop timing with his receivers and he'll be fine.

[listopencil]

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

I understand your point about Cassel.

However, Orton was 1-4 this season. Tebow is 4-1 with the same team. Actually, they traded away their best WR before Tebow took over.

You really think Orton is better than Cassel?

1) We have a young O-Line. They have been playing better and better as the season wears on. Orton doesn't move well, was getting pressured a lot.

2) Our entire D has been getting better and better as well. The D that Tebow has had the last few weeks is better than the one Orton started the year with.

3) Orton wasn't playing as well this year as he was in the past. He was giving up turnovers and making mental errors. I've heard some people say that he was feeling the heat of having Tebow behind him. I don't know. I doubt it. Tebow had a shitty camp and no off season.


So...it's complicated. That 4-1 team is different than the 1-4 one, and it's not just the QB.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by listopencil

1) We have a young O-Line. They have been playing better and better as the season wears on. Orton doesn't move well, was getting pressured a lot.

2) Our entire D has been getting better and better as well. The D that Tebow has had the last few weeks is better than the one Orton started the year with.

3) Orton wasn't playing as well this year as he was in the past. He was giving up turnovers and making mental errors. I've heard some people say that he was feeling the heat of having Tebow behind him. I don't know. I doubt it. Tebow had a shitty camp and no off season.


So...it's complicated. That 4-1 team is different than the 1-4 one, and it's not just the QB.

I think adjusting to a new coaching scheme is also always difficult. Especially in a shortened preseason when players can't even see the playbooks or take reps with teammates.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

Originally Posted by listopencil

1) We have a young O-Line. They have been playing better and better as the season wears on. Orton doesn't move well, was getting pressured a lot.

2) Our entire D has been getting better and better as well. The D that Tebow has had the last few weeks is better than the one Orton started the year with.

3) Orton wasn't playing as well this year as he was in the past. He was giving up turnovers and making mental errors. I've heard some people say that he was feeling the heat of having Tebow behind him. I don't know. I doubt it. Tebow had a shitty camp and no off season.


So...it's complicated. That 4-1 team is different than the 1-4 one, and it's not just the QB.

Just like everybody else, you're failing to recognize the opponents that the Broncos played during Orton's stint and Tebow's stint. The Broncos lost when Orton was playing because they played the Raiders (when they actually had a QB who was not on his couch all year), Titans, Packers, and Chargers (combined 25-15 record). The Broncos have won with Tebow because they've played the Dolphins, Raiders (when they had a QB who was on his couch all year), Chiefs, and Jets (combined 18-21 record). The only time the Broncos played a good team since Tebow has started they lost 45-10. Their defense still sucks. Their QB still sucks. They've just been playing teams with terrible QBs, so they've snuck a few wins in there.

[listopencil]

Originally Posted by thurman merman

Just like everybody else, you're failing to recognize the opponents that the Broncos played during Orton's stint and Tebow's stint. The Broncos lost when Orton was playing because they played the Raiders (when they actually had a QB who was not on his couch all year)

Yeah, uh...no. You're full of shit. We lost by three because Orton literally dropped the ball when McGahee was wide open for a TD. The team played (barely) well enough to win. I actually watched that game. It was ugly as hell.

Titans, Packers, and Chargers (combined 25-15 record)

More bullshit on your part. You are grouping the Packers with the Titans and the Chargers? Ridiculous. The Packers kicked our asses because they are a much better team than we are. Titans was closer because we were closer to their talent level. Chargers played soft D and were ill prepared for Tebow, we still lost.

The Broncos have won with Tebow because they've played the Dolphins, Raiders (when they had a QB who was on his couch all year), Chiefs, and Jets (combined 18-21 record). The only time the Broncos played a good team since Tebow has started they lost 45-10. Their defense still sucks. Their QB still sucks. They've just been playing teams with terrible QBs, so they've snuck a few wins in there.

You have no clue. I swear, it's like you don't even watch football. Go knit us a scarf and find a thread where you won't look like a ****ing moron.

[ChiefsCountry]

Originally Posted by Dave

'Sensible' should be removed from someone's username...

Him and Pioli are the only dipshits who think Cassel is a better QB than Orton.

[SPATCH]

**** this man. **** everything. I hate this god damn team. It's killing me. We'll NEVER have a franchise QB. Never. This is some shit. Some bull shit

[S&BJW]

Orton rocks.....................as long as he has 20 minutes to decide where he throws the ball.........good pick up though as the Raiders have beaten him 4 times in a row I think....

[Red Dawg]

Orton is way way way better than Matt. He's an improvement in every way. I still want a first round QB to be the man but Orton will be alot better to watch than Cassel.

[RustShack]

Could be possible that Orton just didn't fit the offense John Fox implemented as well as he does the one we run... sometimes it takes more than a few weeks for a QB to learn an offense.

[Mile High Mania]

Originally Posted by RustShack

Could be possible that Orton just didn't fit the offense John Fox implemented as well as he does the one we run... sometimes it takes more than a few weeks for a QB to learn an offense.

Neither Orton nor Tebow were selected by the new regime in Denver... Orton wasn't signed on beyond this season. Orton wasn't going to be in the future plans.

I think Orton can be really good on the right team...

[FAX]

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

Neither Orton nor Tebow were selected by the new regime in Denver... Orton wasn't signed on beyond this season. Orton wasn't going to be in the future plans.

I think Orton can be really good on the right team...

Now I'm concerned.

FAX

[Quesadilla Joe]

You can't throw deep if you can't protect long enough. Orton is a dink and dunker, and all of his deep passes come off of playaction.

[FAX]

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

Orton is way way way better than Matt. He's an improvement in every way. I still want a first round QB to be the man but Orton will be alot better to watch than Cassel.

Yep.

And, I can certainly understand why so many people are worried that we're going to repeat the whole "retread quarterback" concept once more. It's been the Chiefs' approach for decades ... many of which I, myself, have suffered through, as well.

However, there is no rule anywhere that says we have to repeat that failed approach, nor is there any rule that says we are going to repeat it, nor is there any rule that says we must jam raw carrots up our hienies.

We have the core of a good team. A team that can win playoff games. And, a team that can dominate the AFC for years. We merely need to add a few pieces ... including a quarterback brimming with verve.

I refuse to hang my head and bitch and moan. Rather, I choose to bitch and moan and then hang my entire self, head and all. But, I don't think it's going to come to that. I think that we'll see continued improvement this year, draft another QB in April, then be super intelligent during the next off-season and training camp by allowing true competition for the starting quarterback role and I don't think the winner will be Orton. And, it won't be Cassel either because he'll either be working as head NFL doofus or heading back to Southern California just in time for the big one.

FAX