JoPo: Why not us? Comparing Royals’ moves to Rays’ decisions

[Deberg_1990]

Sick of the Chiefs.....Lets talk Royals!

http://www.kansascity.com/180/story/852259.html


Jermaine Dye for Neifi Perez....

Carlos Beltran for John Buck and Mark Teahen

Good Lord, ill just kill myself now...




ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. | We’ll start in 1999. Things looked good for the Kansas City Royals in 1999. They had already made the trade with Atlanta for a young outfielder named Jermaine Dye. They decided to make catcher Mike Sweeney a first baseman so they could get his bat in the lineup. They had one established outfielder, Johnny Damon, who seemed to be emerging. They had another, a 22-year-old rookie center fielder named Carlos Beltran, who seemed to have unlimited talent.

And what did they have in Tampa Bay? Not much. The Devil Rays, as they were known then, were in only their second year and already in a hole roughly the depth of Snake River Canyon. They had little money. They had a pretty disinterested fan base. They played in a charmless dome. And they were in the same division as the Yankees, who looked invincible then, and the Red Sox.

Put it this way: The youngest everyday player on those Devil Rays was a 23-year-old outfielder named José Guillen. Tampa released him two years later.

Look at it now. The Rays, no longer Devilish, are in the World Series. The Royals’ most expensive and publicized player, meanwhile, was that outfielder named José Guillen. What happened? How did it happen? Let’s see:

1999

This was the year for the Royals to secure their future. They had four of the first 43 picks in the amateur draft. The thing about the baseball draft is that if you even get one good everyday player or one good starting pitcher or dominant closer, you call it a good year.

The Royals took college pitcher Kyle Snyder with their first pick. Two picks after that, college pitchers Barry Zito and Ben Sheets went back-to-back. Zito would win a Cy Young. Sheets is a three-time All Star.

The Royals took pitcher Mike MacDougal with their second pick. He was the closer and a key figure in the Royals’ surprising 2003 season. But he flamed out quickly.

The Royals took Jay Gehrke and Jimmy Gobble with their other two picks. Gehrke never made it to the majors; Gobble holds on to a shaky job as a lefty specialist.

So, really, the Royals did not get a single everyday player or pitcher in the draft. Tampa, meanwhile, took two-time All-Star and four-time stolen base champ Carl Crawford in the second round. That was the first piece for this championship team.

2000

One of the other things that helps in the baseball draft is, occasionally, getting lucky with a late-round pick. The Royals, for years, refused to pay later picks more than a nominal signing bonus. And because of that, it has been many years since they have found a helpful player after the first few rounds of the draft.

Royals general manager Dayton Moore says this is changing and the Royals need to draft aggressively all the way through. A good example: This year, the Rays hit the jackpot in the 16th round, when they took pitcher James Shields out of Hart High School. Shields was probably the Rays’ best pitcher this season (14-8, 3.56 ERA, 215 innings pitched).

2001

This was a disastrous year for the Royals. First, they had their famously catastrophic draft this year. They took Colt Griffin with their first-round pick because he had thrown 100 mph in a high school game. They took outfielder Roscoe Crosby with their second-round pick because he looked like Ken Griffey Jr. when he played. Griffin couldn’t throw strikes, Crosby didn’t seem especially interested in playing baseball, and the Royals did not get a single major-league player out of this draft.

They also traded away two of their young star players. First, in January, they dealt Johnny Damon (and second baseman Mark Ellis, who has become an everyday player) to Oakland in a three-way deal that brought back shortstop Angel Berroa and closer Roberto Hernandez. Berroa was the key, and in 2003 he was the AL Rookie of the Year. But, like MacDougal, he deteriorated quickly. The Royals simply did not get enough for one of their most valuable assets.

But that was gold compared to the next trade, six months later, when the Royals dealt Jermaine Dye for Neifi Perez. For many, that trade — and the remarkably awful way that Perez played once he got to Kansas City — symbolizes the Royals this decade. I’m not sure it’s a symbol. I do know that the four 100-loss seasons that were soon to follow go back to any mistakes in 2001.

The Rays didn’t have a particularly good year either, though. They did draft a speedy outfielder in the 32nd round, Joey Gathright, who would help the Rays in an unexpected way.

2002

There is no sure way to find a superstar. A lot of things have to come together just right for it to happen. The Royals have tried everything to find their star. They have paid a lot of money in free agency. They’ve made trades. They’ve spent tens of millions in draft-pick signing bonuses. So far, though, the Royals are still waiting.

The Rays had the second pick in the 2002 draft. They took a shortstop out of high school, B.J. Upton. And it looks like Upton will become a star. He’s pretty close now. He is only 24, and he hit 24 homers in his first season, he stole 44 bases and walked 97 times this season, he just had a pretty remarkable playoff series.

That same year, the Royals took Zack Greinke in the first round. We all know that Greinke has gone through some hard times, but now the Royals hope to build around him.

At this point, by the way, both teams were absolute messes. The Rays lost 106 games and fired manager Hal McRae. The Royals lost 100 for the first time in their history and fired their own manager, Tony Muser (who found out about it from reporters). They also signed Mike Sweeney to a long-term deal. Sweeney would never again get 500 at-bats in a season. That’s just bad luck.

2003

The Royals, led by Carlos Beltran, were in first place in the AL Central as late as Aug. 29. The Rays were terrible. But in the draft, the Rays took a raw and talented outfielder, Delmon Young, who would play a huge role on the World Series team without being a part of it. The Royals, meanwhile, took Chris Lubanski who, at this point, looks like he probably won’t make it.

2004

This is when the Rays really started to build their team. They drafted pitcher Andy Sonnanstine in the 13th round, and he won 13 games for Tampa this year.

More, though, they made a spectacular trade. They dealt pitcher Victor Zambrano to the Mets for lefty ace Scott Kazmir. It was viewed, even at the time the Rays made it, as an absolute steal, and it has turned out that way. Kazmir, when healthy, is one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball.

The Royals, meanwhile, made a trade of their own. They dealt the last of their 1999 stars, Carlos Beltran. They got John Buck and Mark Teahen. Four years later, the Royals are still waiting and hoping on both.

2005

And that’s a key phrase for struggling baseball teams: Waiting and hoping. It does seem that bad baseball teams spend a whole lot of time waiting and hoping. Right now, the Royals are waiting and hoping for third baseman Alex Gordon to become a star. Gordon was taken with the second pick in the 2005 draft, and he has shown some promise. But that’s all, so far.

The next year, the Rays would take a third baseman in the draft, and there was no waiting and hoping time for him.

2006

The Royals had the first pick in the draft, and they are still publicly defending their choice of Luke Hochevar. And it’s true, it is way too early to make any judgments on Hochevar, who showed occasional flash in his first full season despite going 6-12 with a 5.51 ERA. You know the story. Waiting and hoping.

Meanwhile, two picks after Hochevar went, the Rays took third baseman Evan Longoria. You know, he had a fabulous rookie season. If he had not gotten hurt, he might have been both the rookie of the year and the MVP. As it was, he hit 27 homers, drove in 85 RBIs, played sterling defense at third base and even stole seven bases without getting caught.

Things were really beginning to come together for Tampa. The Rays traded for catcher Dioner Navarro, who made the All-Star team this year. They traded for right-handed pitcher Edwin Jackson, who won 14 games this year. And, finally, they traded that speedy outfielder they got in the 32nd round, Gathright, to Kansas City for reliever J.P. Howell. At the time, it seemed like one of those minor deals that would not likely help either club much. This year, though, while Gathright struggled, Howell went 6-1 with a 2.22 ERA out of the Rays’ bullpen.

During the offseason, the Rays signed second baseman Akinori Iwamura out of Japan. He has been their leadoff hitter the last two years.

2007

Everyone talks about how, in baseball, you sometimes have to get lucky. At the beginning of the year, a one-time big prospect, Carlos Peña, was on the market. He had been released twice, and several teams were talking to him. The Royals were one of those teams, according to general manager Dayton Moore. But the Royals did not sign him, in part because they already had young first baseman Ryan Shealy.

The Rays did sign Peña. Now, maybe it was luck. Maybe the Rays just tried a little bit harder. Maybe the Royals put too much faith in Shealy. Whatever the case, Peña hit 46 homers that first year. And led the Rays with 31 more homers this year.

The Rays also had the first pick in the draft, and they took a tall lefty out of Vanderbilt, David Price. In game seven of the American League Championship Series against Boston, Price because the youngest player to ever get a save in a game seven.

2008

Before the 2008 season, the Rays made one more bold move. They still had Delmon Young, the talented, former No. 1 pick in the draft. Many teams are afraid to trade away their talented young players. The Rays dealt Young to Minnesota in a big trade that brought back pitcher Matt Garza and shortstop Jason Bartlett.

It was a bold move … precisely the kind of chance the Royals have been unwilling to take. At the time, many thought the Rays had made a huge mistake. And, of course, Young still could become a star. But Bartlett has been a steadying presence at shortstop. Garza won 11 games this year and was dominant in game seven against Boston.

And with that, the Rays are in the World Series. As you look back, you notice there were no magic moments. The Rays made plenty of mistakes. But they kept picking up good players. They drafted a couple, Longoria and Upton, high. They hit on a couple of late draft picks. They took some chances and made some deals. And here’s something you will notice: The Rays did not sign a single big-money free agent — the closest thing is the $4 million or so they spent on closer Troy Percival.

The Royals, meanwhile, have spent a lot of money on free agents ($23 million per year on just two — José Guillen and Gil Meche). And they have not yet hit big on any of their moves. If Greinke, Gordon, Butler, Hochevar and any of the touted draft picks the last couple of years start to play like stars, things can turn quickly. If the Royals can make a good deal in the offseason, that might make a difference.

Might. Could. It’s October in Kansas City, and like every October, all anyone can do is wait and hope. And watch the Rays play Philadelphia in the World Series.

[SCTrojan]

It could happen - I have more confidence in Moore than I ever had with Baird, or Carl Peterson. At least it looks like they are moving in the right direction.

They need a couple more starters and some of the prospects to pan out. Not just Gordon and Butler, but Hosmer, Moustakas, Cortes and maybe that Melville kid they drafted this year.

Who knows, but it will be interesting to watch.

[DaKCMan AP]

Go Rays!

[StcChief]

when you got nothing... you got nothing to lose.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Gee, that was uplifting. *sniff*

[triple]

Originally Posted by StcChief

when you got nothing... you got nothing to lose.

the american bard, a quote for every situation.

[SithCeNtZ]

Shocking article. Who knew that if the Royals would just hit on their draft picks and get some other extremely lucky players rediscovering their careers(Pena, Jackson, Nevarro) they could be as good as the Rays?

[gblowfish]

Royals being run by committee, then run by Wal Mart has been 10 more years of futility. Hopefully Dayton Moore can turn this thing around. I think he's on the right track.

Allard Baird ought to have to face a firing squad.

[Deberg_1990]

Originally Posted by gblowfish

Allard Baird ought to have to face a firing squad.

No doubt.

hard to believe we wasted a lineup of Damon, Beltran, Sweeney, Dye, Randa with ZERO pitching.

Then we decide to dump most of those guys.

[ChiefsCountry]

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

No doubt.

hard to believe we wasted a lineup of Damon, Beltran, Sweeney, Dye, Randa with ZERO pitching.

Then we decide to dump most of those guys.

The dumping I can live with it, its what we got for them is the problem. You trade a prime talent like Beltran you better get something better than Mark Teahan for it.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Deberg_1990

No doubt.

hard to believe we wasted a lineup of Damon, Beltran, Sweeney, Dye, Randa with ZERO pitching.

Then we decide to dump most of those guys.

Think about the fact that had you just let them walk you could have gotten 10 first round draft picks for them.

[CoMoChief]

Wow, that article just made me wanna cry.

[WilliamTheIrish]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Think about the fact that had you just let them walk you could have gotten 10 first round draft picks for them.

At the time the prevailing thought by the media (and by Baird) was "You gotta get something for them now".

Still scratching my head over that.

[Demonpenz]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Think about the fact that had you just let them walk you could have gotten 10 first round draft picks for them.

I am an a idiot

[Sure-Oz]

This is why Baird is no longer a GM and probably will never do anything significant again in MLB