Chiefs 3-4 Defense

**ChiefGator** · 03-01-2009, 06:35 AM

Throughout all the draft, trade, and free agency threads there seem to be two recurring themes:

1) We will be running the 3-4 defense next year. Hence discussions like "Why aren't we targeting X, who would be perfect for the 3-4 defense."

2) We don't currently have any players on the team that fit a 3-4 defense. Some claim we are going to have to throw away all our d-linemen and hope we can somehow fit DJ in somewhere, but maybe trade him for a 5th.

Both of these can't be right. Either we have players that will fit and we will go that way, or our players don't fit that scheme and we won't go that way.

If both of these are right, this implies...

3) Our coaches are either idiots or completely unflexible, which I don't believe.

Why a new thread? Not to discuss #2. Don't want to see players names.

But, WHY is there a belief that we are going to 3-4? I haven't heard this at all, and I think I've been listening.

kstater · 03-01-2009, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefGator

But, WHY is there a belief that we are going to 3-4? I haven't heard this at all, and I think I've been listening.

Most of the coaches come from a 3-4. Don't know if you watched any football last year, but we don't have the players to run either a 3-4 or a 4-3. Including Vrable in the trade all but locks up a switch. Probably go hybrid this year, and as the players come in over the next couple years, switch to it full time.

CupidStunt · 03-01-2009, 07:07 AM

Three reasons why: (1) Pioli; (2) traded for Vrabel, a prototype rush LB; and (3) Adam Schefter, sometimes right and sometimes wrong, said so.

**ChiefGator** · 03-01-2009, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kstater

Don't know if you watched any football last year, but we don't have the players to run either a 3-4 or a 4-3.

I laugh every time I read this actually. Certainly a bit true.

Mecca · 03-01-2009, 07:28 AM

Mike Vrabel being traded for pretty much says we are going to be moving to a 3-4...

Pioli Zombie · 03-01-2009, 07:50 AM

I love it when people say "but our talent is 4-3 they should scheme to the talent"

THE TALENT SUCKS!!!!!

Don't do things based on past personnel mistakes. Stop the runaway train now and from this day forward do things right. Even if you have to scrap yesterdays errors.

If you have deadwood. Clear them out. Even if they were high picks. Get people in who can and want to play the correct way.

Knowing how the Patriots did things from the moment Belichick and Pioli arrived it wouldnt surprise me if Gonzales, LJ, and Waters were all gone by training camp. There are no stars. Even Brady is the ultimate its not about me guy on that team. Most of the league does not get this.

Anyway sorry for the rant but the Chiefs will do now what is good for the Chiefs, not what works for any one player.
Posted via Mobile Device

Mecca · 03-01-2009, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pioli Zombie

I love it when people say "but our talent is 4-3 they should scheme to the talent"

THE TALENT SUCKS!!!!!

Don't do things based on past personnel mistakes. Stop the runaway train now and from this day forward do things right. Even if you have to scrap yesterdays errors.

If you have deadwood. Clear them out. Even if they were high picks. Get people in who can and want to play the correct way.

Knowing how the Patriots did things from the moment Belichick and Pioli arrived it wouldnt surprise me if Gonzales, LJ, and Waters were all gone by training camp. There are no stars. Even Brady is the ultimate its not about me guy on that team. Most of the league does not get this.

Anyway sorry for the rant but the Chiefs will do now what is good for the Chiefs, not what works for any one player.
Posted via Mobile Device

I've always thought Gonzalez was going to get traded...he doesn't strike me as a Patriots type of guy.

**ChiefGator** · 03-01-2009, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pioli Zombie

I love it when people say "but our talent is 4-3 they should scheme to the talent"

Well, the coaches did say they would look at the players they had and then decide the scheme based on that.

And I always love it when people think there is absolutely no talent on this team at all. Pessimistic and overreacting much?

Mecca · 03-01-2009, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefGator

Well, the coaches did say they would look at the players they had and then decide the scheme based on that.

That's a nice line to use but coaches always go with the schemes they feel comfortable with and we have a ton of people who are from the 3-4 and when you take over a 2-14 team their reaction is like "psh there is no talent"

As far as the front 7 goes we are pretty close to having no talent.

Pioli Zombie · 03-01-2009, 08:04 AM

I'm having flashbacks to 2000 when the Patriots had a star system. Bledsoe, Terry Glenn, Lawyer Milloy, Ty Law,Ted Johnson,Willie McGinest. These guys were in the papers all the time we read about their parties at nightclubs. They were stars don't you know and there wasn't a microphone they didn't like. Belichick ended all that. You produce and shut up or you are gone. Glenn was the first to keep testing it. He was benched during a Super Bowl run. Then Bledsoe pouted to the press and in meetings while the Patriots won a Super Bowl. Sure the myth is how
Bledsoe was so great handling everything. Read any book about the Patriots. The guy wouldn't even go to the parade after. He was gone. Then Milloy. Then Law. McGinest was the one who got it and revitilized his career under Belichick.

Gonzo and LJ better get it fast. Its not just what you do on the field its also your mentality. they don't collect talent. They put together the best 53 man TEAM.
Posted via Mobile Device

**ChiefGator** · 03-01-2009, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

As far as the front 7 goes we are pretty close to having no talent.

Two first rounders, one second rounder, and one third rounder disagree with you, none of which were considered major reaches at the time.

Falls to coaching and schemeing, or lack there of.

I just think we may all be getting a bit hasty in proclaiming we are going to any particular defense when the coaches haven't even taken the field with these players once and haven't declared anything either.

Taking an over-the-hill LB to act as a leader doesn't dictate the defense anymore than a top 5 pick last year dictates the defense.

Mecca · 03-01-2009, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefGator

Two first rounders, one second rounder, and one third rounder disagree with you, none of which were considered major reaches at the time.

Falls to coaching and schemeing, or lack there of.

I just think we may all be getting a bit hasty in proclaiming we are going to any particular defense when the coaches haven't even taken the field with these players once and haven't declared anything either.

Taking an over-the-hill LB to act as a leader doesn't dictate the defense anymore than a top 5 pick last year dictates the defense.

That top 5 pick was taken by the last regime...new regimes don't care about what the past one did, it's true just look around.

They can be high picks all they want, they'll be shuffled out if they don't fit scheme or attitude wise. If you're counting Hali he literally has no spot in a 3-4 so we're about to wave bye to him.

They'll get their chances to show what they can do but none of them are going to be held onto because they were high picks.

Will · 03-01-2009, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kstater

Most of the coaches come from a 3-4. Don't know if you watched any football last year, but we don't have the players to run either a 3-4 or a 4-3. Including Vrable in the trade all but locks up a switch. Probably go hybrid this year, and as the players come in over the next couple years, switch to it full time.

I disagree that we don't have the talent to run a 4-3. Almost our entire defense is very young with many of them just now getting used to the speed and physicality of the NFL game. Now they may not be the most talented guys in the NFL but they still could be very good. I would dare to say that if they would have had some coaching in the last couple of years that was worth a damn then they would have probably been much better.

el borracho · 03-01-2009, 08:35 AM

I literally can't believe people care what happens to Tamba Hali. Just cannot believe it.

Mecca · 03-01-2009, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will

I disagree that we don't have the talent to run a 4-3. Almost our entire defense is very young with many of them just now getting used to the speed and physicality of the NFL game. Now they may not be the most talented guys in the NFL but they still could be very good. I would dare to say that if they would have had some coaching in the last couple of years that was worth a damn then they would have probably been much better.

Would you like to inform me who these players are, we don't have an end worth a damn...

03-01-2009, 06:35 AM
ChiefGator Can these boys not play? Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Northcentral Florida Casino cash: $7682956	3-4 Defense Throughout all the draft, trade, and free agency threads there seem to be two recurring themes: 1) We will be running the 3-4 defense next year. Hence discussions like "Why aren't we targeting X, who would be perfect for the 3-4 defense." 2) We don't currently have any players on the team that fit a 3-4 defense. Some claim we are going to have to throw away all our d-linemen and hope we can somehow fit DJ in somewhere, but maybe trade him for a 5th. Both of these can't be right. Either we have players that will fit and we will go that way, or our players don't fit that scheme and we won't go that way. If both of these are right, this implies... 3) Our coaches are either idiots or completely unflexible, which I don't believe. Why a new thread? Not to discuss #2. Don't want to see players names. But, WHY is there a belief that we are going to 3-4? I haven't heard this at all, and I think I've been listening.
Posts: 4,597

03-01-2009, 07:07 AM	#3
CupidStunt offense > defense Join Date: Jul 2005 Casino cash: $2463332	Three reasons why: (1) Pioli; (2) traded for Vrabel, a prototype rush LB; and (3) Adam Schefter, sometimes right and sometimes wrong, said so.
Posts: 8,920

03-01-2009, 07:28 AM	#5
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2537050	Mike Vrabel being traded for pretty much says we are going to be moving to a 3-4...
Posts: 110,994

03-01-2009, 07:50 AM	#6
Pioli Zombie Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: olathe,kansas Casino cash: $10004900	I love it when people say "but our talent is 4-3 they should scheme to the talent" THE TALENT SUCKS!!!!! Don't do things based on past personnel mistakes. Stop the runaway train now and from this day forward do things right. Even if you have to scrap yesterdays errors. If you have deadwood. Clear them out. Even if they were high picks. Get people in who can and want to play the correct way. Knowing how the Patriots did things from the moment Belichick and Pioli arrived it wouldnt surprise me if Gonzales, LJ, and Waters were all gone by training camp. There are no stars. Even Brady is the ultimate its not about me guy on that team. Most of the league does not get this. Anyway sorry for the rant but the Chiefs will do now what is good for the Chiefs, not what works for any one player. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 11,077

03-01-2009, 08:04 AM	#10
Pioli Zombie Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: olathe,kansas Casino cash: $10004900	I'm having flashbacks to 2000 when the Patriots had a star system. Bledsoe, Terry Glenn, Lawyer Milloy, Ty Law,Ted Johnson,Willie McGinest. These guys were in the papers all the time we read about their parties at nightclubs. They were stars don't you know and there wasn't a microphone they didn't like. Belichick ended all that. You produce and shut up or you are gone. Glenn was the first to keep testing it. He was benched during a Super Bowl run. Then Bledsoe pouted to the press and in meetings while the Patriots won a Super Bowl. Sure the myth is how Bledsoe was so great handling everything. Read any book about the Patriots. The guy wouldn't even go to the parade after. He was gone. Then Milloy. Then Law. McGinest was the one who got it and revitilized his career under Belichick. Gonzo and LJ better get it fast. Its not just what you do on the field its also your mentality. they don't collect talent. They put together the best 53 man TEAM. Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 11,077

03-01-2009, 08:35 AM	#14
el borracho In Pat We Trust Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Albuquerque, NM Casino cash: $6299148	I literally can't believe people care what happens to Tamba Hali. Just cannot believe it.
Posts: 11,835