***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***

[JakeF]

A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana

Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.

Originally Posted by Dartgod

People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.

California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.

“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”

The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.

The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”

Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.

The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.

The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.

A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.

Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.

“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”

It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.

“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”

On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.

“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”

According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.

More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.

But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.

“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”

CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.

Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.

“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”

[Donger]

Originally Posted by mac459

Neither are war deaths, so why compare? People were using Vietnam to further their argument to do more on clamping things down. Why can they use none contagious deaths for their argument but not the other side?

I haven't seen anyone using comparative war deaths to further their argument to do more on clamping things down. Like I said, just an comparison between two historical events.

I have seen people say that COVID-19 has killed more American than the Vietnam War did. And that's accurate. Now almost three times as many.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

And so has heart disease.

Correct. And you can't go to the grocery store and catch heart disease from a person with heart disease.

If you don't or can't understand the difference still, I can't help you.

[Perineum Ripper]

Originally Posted by Donger

I haven't seen anyone using comparative war deaths to further their argument to do more on clamping things down. Like I said, just an comparison between two historical events.

I have seen people say that COVID-19 has killed more American than the Vietnam War did. And that's accurate. Now almost three times as many.

I have seen them use war deaths to further their argument. So like I asked, why can one side use non contagious deaths to further their argument but the other side can’t?


You may use them as a comparison and that’s fine, I have a big ****ing problem with people not being fair on calling out those arguments. That scream not contagious at people saying heart disease is used as an argument, then not saying shit when war deaths are used for argument.

[Perineum Ripper]

Originally Posted by Donger

Correct. And you can't go to the grocery store and catch heart disease from a person with heart disease.

If you don't or can't understand the difference still, I can't help you.

You can’t go to the store and die in the Vietnam war either.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by mac459

I have seen them use war deaths to further their argument. So like I asked, why can one side use non contagious deaths to further their argument but the other side can’t?


You may use them as a comparison and that’s fine, I have a big ****ing problem with people not being fair on calling out those arguments. That scream not contagious at people saying heart disease is used as an argument, then not saying shit when war deaths are used for argument.

You've seen that here? I wouldn't use that argument, so you'll need to ask them. I would use it as an historical comparison based on total deaths.

Again though, some people try to use heart disease and car deaths to argue that those happen every year and we don't shut down over them, so we shouldn't have shut down over COVID-19. That's when the contagious part comes into play. They aren't comparable in that important respect and that's where the attempted comparison falls apart.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by mac459

You can’t go to the store and die in the Vietnam war either.

No, you can't. That would require going back in time.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by Donger

I haven't seen anyone using comparative war deaths to further their argument to do more on clamping things down. Like I said, just an comparison between two historical events.

I have seen people say that COVID-19 has killed more American than the Vietnam War did. And that's accurate. Now almost three times as many.

And you don't even understand that paragraph one directly contradicts paragraph 2.

And then you post this -

Originally Posted by Donger

You've seen that here? I wouldn't use that argument, so you'll need to ask them. I would use it as an historical comparison based on total deaths.

I mean holy shit dude this is ridiculous even for you.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

And you don't even understand that paragraph one directly contradicts paragraph 2.

No, I don't because it doesn't. Just to cut to the chase, I realize that you don't have the ability to understand why they aren't contradictory.

[Perineum Ripper]

Originally Posted by Donger

You've seen that here? I wouldn't use that argument, so you'll need to ask them. I would use it as an historical comparison based on total deaths.

Again though, some people try to use heart disease and car deaths to argue that those happen every year and we don't shut down over them, so we shouldn't have shut down over COVID-19. That's when the contagious part comes into play. They aren't comparable in that important respect and that's where the attempted comparison falls apart.

Yes, here. I have no problem using death numbers from other things as a comparison. That helps people get a grasp on the severity.


I tried asking the board, due to me not remembering exactly who made the argument. Other people stepped forward and started offering opinions on it, but my question wasn’t getting answered. Maybe I should have made it more clear, I thought it was obvious to those who had made the argument or seen it.


Again, I have no problem with people saying it is not contagious when the argument is lined up as you put it. That is not my issue at all though, so I’m not sure why you keep bringing it up. I have said a few times I don’t have a problem with it like that.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by Donger

No, I don't because it doesn't. Just to cut to the chase, I realize that you don't have the ability to understand why they aren't contradictory.

I haven't seen that except where I have seen that and I will extrapolate on what was said even further then claim in the next post I wouldn't use that argument/ Donger.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by mac459

Yes, here. I have no problem using death numbers from other things as a comparison. That helps people get a grasp on the severity.


I tried asking the board, due to me not remembering exactly who made the argument. Other people stepped forward and started offering opinions on it, but my question wasn’t getting answered. Maybe I should have made it more clear, I thought it was obvious to those who had made the argument or seen it.


Again, I have no problem with people saying it is not contagious when the argument is lined up as you put it. That is not my issue at all though, so I’m not sure why you keep bringing it up. I have said a few times I don’t have a problem with it like that.

Then we're in agreement.

I have, and have had, issue with those who try to compare heart disease, car accidents and other other non-contagious deaths to COVID-19 as an attempt at arguing that we shouldn't have locked down because we don't for the them. Honestly, it's such a simplistic and faulty comparison that I was stunned that anyone would try it, let alone keep trying it.

Alas, here we are.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

I haven't seen that except where I have seen that and I will extrapolate on what was said even further then claim in the next post I wouldn't use that argument/ Donger.

Feel free to explain how those two paragraphs are contradictory.

[dirk digler]

I believe this same heart issue sidelined the Red Sox's ace a week or so ago for the season after he had Covid.

Heart condition linked with COVID-19 fuels Power 5 concern about season's viability

https://www.espn.com/college-footbal...ason-viability

A rare heart condition that could be linked with the coronavirus is fueling concern among Power 5 conference administrators about the viability of college sports this fall.

Myocarditis, inflammation of the heart muscle, has been found in at least five Big Ten Conference athletes and among several other athletes in other conferences, according to two sources with knowledge of athletes' medical care.

The condition is usually caused by a viral infection, including those that cause the common cold, H1N1 influenza or mononucleosis. Left undiagnosed and untreated, it can cause heart damage and sudden cardiac arrest, which can be fatal. It is a rare condition, but the COVID-19 virus has been linked with myocarditis with a higher frequency than other viruses, based on limited studies and anecdotal evidence since the start of the pandemic.

The concern has "made the bar higher" for returning to fall sports, said Dr. Jonathan Drezner, director of the University of Washington Medicine Center for Sports Cardiology and a sports medicine physician who advises the NCAA on cardiac issues, "and it could be we don't get there."

Conference officials and athletic directors told ESPN that the uncertainty about the long-term effects of myocarditis has been discussed in meetings of presidents and chancellors, commissioners and athletics directors, and health advisory board members from the Big Ten, Pac-12 and other conferences around the country. Last week, college administrators saw a Facebook post from Debbie Rucker, mother of Indiana offensive lineman Brady Feeney, who wrote that her son was dealing with potential heart problems after battling COVID-19.

The Mid-American Conference, after receiving medical reports about myocarditis and other problems associated with the coronavirus, was the first FBS conference to postpone fall sports on Saturday.

"What we don't know was really haunting us, and that's why we came to our final decision," Northern Illinois athletics director Sean Frazier said. "That's part of the data that our presidents used. This mom gave us a play-by-play. That stuff is extremely scary."

Dr. John MacKnight, the head primary care team physician at the University of Virginia, said that while questions about COVID-19 testing availability, turnaround time for results, and the impact of a possible community surge of cases have all been factors in deciding to return to competition, the long-term cardiac concerns for athletes may be the tipping point.

"We are collectively, as a sports nation, not quite ready to feel entirely comfortable with what that may look like for our young people down the line, and we are not going to put them in that situation," he said. MacKnight, who directs care for Virginia's athletes, and other school physicians are members of advisory groups that counsel universities and conferences on medical decisions.

MacKnight said "the likelihood the individual goes on to have myocardial complication is very low" in athletes who had no or very low-grade COVID-19 symptoms, but added that there needs to be more studies and data.

"There have been some concerns raised for that very reason: Do you not have uneasiness about having athletes participating knowing that you don't know what that longer-range outlook is? The answer is of course, yes," he said. "We don't have enough information to say this is the likelihood that this will or will not happen."

A spokesperson for the NCAA deferred questions about the number of athletes with myocarditis to individual colleges or conferences. NCAA chief medical officer Dr. Brian Hainline was not available for comment.

Dr. Matthew Martinez, director of sports cardiology for Atlantic Health System in New Jersey, said he has received calls from physicians from at least a dozen Power 5 schools who have identified more than a dozen athletes with some post-COVID-19 myocardial injury. He said about half of them had symptoms.

"Initially we thought if you didn't have significant symptoms that you are probably at less risk. We are now finding that that may not be true," he said.

Martinez, who is the league cardiologist for Major League Soccer, team cardiologist for the New York Jets and a consultant for the National Basketball Players Association, said based on what he's seen so far among professional athletes who have had COVID-19, "I'm hopeful the number is under 5%" who have heart-related issues.

Even though the percentage is likely small, Martinez said there is still so much unknown that it is wise to take a conservative approach in returning athletes to play.

[TLO]

Something just happened at Trump's press conference. Secret Service guy walked up to him and Trump left the room immediately.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by TLO

Something just happened at Trump's press conference. Secret Service guy walked up to him and Trump left the room immediately.

Apparently a shooting near the White House.