What's wrong with Mecole Hardman - Part 2

[dlphg9]

Spoiler alert!

Nothing is wrong with him! Unless you consider Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce as being a problem.

Mecole was 3rd on the team in targets (62), rec yards (560), and rec TDs (4). Those stats are right in line with any other teams 3rd most productive receiver and none of those other teams had 2 guys that were 1st team AP in front of that guy.

Green Bay Packers #1 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Robert Tonyan - 59 targets, 52 rec, 586 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 212
Rec - 148
Yards - 2064

Buffalo Bills #2 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Gabriel Davis - 62 targets, 35 rec, 599 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 273
Rec - 209
Yards - 2502

Tampa Bay Buccaneers #3 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Rob Gronkowski - 77 targets, 45 rec, 623 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 193
Rec - 135
Yards - 1846

Tennessee Titans #4 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Jonnu Smith - 65 targets, 41 rec, 448 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 198
Rec - 135
Yards - 2059

New Orleans Saints #5 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Jared Cook - 60 targets, 37 rec, 504 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 189
Rec - 144
Yards - 1482

Baltimore Ravens #7 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Willie Snead - 48 targets, 33 rec, 432 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 188
Rec - 116
Yards - 1470

Seattle Seahawks #8 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
David Moore - 47 targets, 35 rec, 417 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 261
Rec - 183
Yards - 2357

Indianapolis Colts #9 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Michael Pittman Jr. - 61 targets, 40 rec, 503 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 164
Rec - 99
Yards - 1391

Las Vegas Raiders #10 ranked scoring offense
3rd most productive receiving option
Hunter Renfrow - 77 targets, 56 rec, 656 yds

Top 2 options
Targets - 227
Rec - 155
Yards - 2092

Average for top 10 scoring offense's 3rd most productive receiving option :

Targets - 62
Receptions - 41
Yards - 530

Average for top 10 scoring offense's top 2 most productive receiving options combined :

Targets - 212
Receptions - 147
Yards - 1918


This is how Hardman stacks up against the other teams 3rd receiving option

Targets - 62 (62 avg)
Receptions - 41 (41 avg)
Yards - 560 (530 avg)

Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce combined

Targets - 280 (most in group)
Receptions - 192 (2nd most in group)
Yards - 2692 (most in group)

So what we can see from these stats above is that nothing is up with Mecole Hardman. His targets and reception matched the average of the 9 other top offenses 3rd receiving option and he was above average in yards, but the big huge difference is Travis Kelce and Tyreek Hill just happen to be on the same team as him. Those two have 68 more combined targets, 45 more combined receptions, and 774 more combined yards than the others teams top 2 receiving threats.

TLDR;

Nothing is wrong, he's right in line with the other teams 3rd most productive pass catchers. Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce are monsters and the best pass catching duo in a long ass time.

PS:

Seriously Tyreek Hill and Travis Kelce are so good! There was only 11 QBs with more TD passes than those 2 had receiving TDs.

PSS:

****ing Cam Newton started 15 games and had 45 less passing yards than Hill and Kelce had rec yards in the same amount of games!

PSSS:

****ing MVP Lamar had 65 more passing yards than Hill and Kelce had rec yards and they tied for the same amount of passing TDs to receiving TDs.

[suzzer99]

I hope he proves me wrong this season, but I feel like we know what Hardman is at this point - a speedster with average hands and shitty instincts.

I think we'll get usefulness out of him the next two years, but my money is on no second contract.

Now off to go cry some more about DKM #22 on NFL 100.

[mililo4cpa]

Originally Posted by Rasputin

Sammy Watkins 2020 stats granted had bruised vagina and missed some games but he was our #2 WR

37 receptions (that means he caught 37 balls)
421 yards (that means he gained 421 yards)
11.4 avg (that means his average yards he gained per catch)
37 long (that means his longest play during the season)
2 TD (that means he had 2 touchdowns for the 2020 season)



Mecole Hardman "gadget player" stats 2020 granted he didn't have a bruised vagina and miss some games.

41 receptions
560 yards
13.7 avg
49 long
4 TD


now maybe Mecole needed to step it up and take more advantage of opportunity when Sammy was out of games but did y'all see the catch in the back of the endzone against the Saints?


I'll take Mecole Hardman as a gadget player or jet sweep kinda guy any time because we are winning ****ing championships and he is part of our success.

It's all in y'alls head that he doesn't have chemistry with Patrick Mahomes II but this is the third season for Mecole give him the chance to succeed before calling him a bust. He has game. He has given us opportunities to win games more than he ever has cost us any games. The Super Bowl Patrick didn't have 2 seconds in the pocket there was no pocket so don't blame chemistry when Patrick was running for his life the entire game and that defense crushed our offensive line Tyreek Hill and Kelse had shit game as well.


Give the kid a chance, or not, be an asshole just to pound your chest when he makes a mistake and come on here telling everyone how much he sucks.

In my opinion, and even with Sammy, I never thought the Chiefs ever really thought of receivers as #1, #2, etc., but more interchanging parts that each player has to know and can be called on at any moment. This is why it takes young guys a while to catch on to the offense....because there simply is so much to learn and understand, and the player is expected to know all of it.

While I'm not entirely on the Mecole wagon, and would love nothing else than to see him elevate his game further, to deny that he has made plays whether catching the ball, running the ball, or returning the ball is to be in denial. He certainly has made a significant contribution to the team, and will do so again this year.

With that said, I'm not certain he ever does significantly more than what he's done to date. I sure hope he takes the next step, as we might be the best offense in the history of the NFL if he does. But he's certainly a key component on a pretty dang good offense as is, and we can and will a bunch of games because of it.

[ToxSocks]

Mecole seems to have trouble catching balls at or above his head. Meanwhile, he seems to have a knack for catching footballs that are thrown at his ankles.

[Sassy Squatch]

Originally Posted by suzzer99

I hope he proves me wrong this season, but I feel like we know what Hardman is at this point - a speedster with average hands and shitty instincts.

I think we'll get usefulness out of him the next two years, but my money is on no second contract.

Now off to go cry some more about DKM #22 on NFL 100.

That one is going to sting for a long time. Every time I watch Seattle he seems to make an amazing catch on a broken play. Only imagine what he and Mahomes could do when it comes to those broken sandlot plays.

[KChiefs1]

Originally Posted by Red Dawg

Mahomes looked annoyed with Hardman last night and I don't like it. He also is probably annoyed with not throwing a td in the pre season.

Mahomes has chewed out Hardman a lot over the past 3 seasons. They are never on the same page.

Hardman is a nice gadget player but he’s not a #2 WR who can be counted on in a clutch situation. Pringle fits that role better.

[KChiefs1]

Originally Posted by suzzer99

I think we'll get usefulness out of him the next two years, but my money is on no second contract.

Now off to go cry some more about DKM #22 on NFL 100.

I bet Veach kicks himself every time he thinks about that decision.

[smithandrew051]

Originally Posted by Superturtle

That one is going to sting for a long time. Every time I watch Seattle he seems to make an amazing catch on a broken play. Only imagine what he and Mahomes could do when it comes to those broken sandlot plays.

It does hurt….buuuutttt…

We got Kelce in the third.

We got Chris Jones and Tyreek Hill in the same draft. Any team in the league could have had both.

Several teams who needed a QB passed on Mahomes. We got him.

Any team could have had Sneed. Same with Trey Smith. Same with Creed Humphrey. Same with Mike Danna. Same with Tershawn Wharton. Same with Willie Gay. Same with Lucas Niang.

Hope this eases that pain a bit.

[ToxSocks]

Pringle really is looking the part right now.

[BigChiefFan]

Some people need to keep things in perspective. Hardman is only 23 years old and already put up solid numbers. 14 TDs in 2 years and 1000 yards plus in receiving and 1200 yards plus in return yardage is a solid contributor to our team. Can Hardman still improve his game? The answer is a definitive, yes, but he’s been a good player for us. He’s still learning to be great and isn’t there, yet, but I predict big things from him this year. He’s been a Pro Bowler in his young career and has all the intangibles to make the transition from good to great. He has Mahomes for QB. Once they perfect the nuisances of their chemistry, our team will be hard to stop. I truly believe Hardman makes us forget Watkins this year. The kid is still learning the game, we could do a lot worse than Hardman and should have some patience with his development. Just my 2 cents.

[Rasputin]

Originally Posted by KChiefs1

Mahomes has chewed out Hardman a lot over the past 3 seasons. They are never on the same page.

Hardman is a nice gadget player but he’s not a #2 WR who can be counted on in a clutch situation. Pringle fits that role better.

not clutch

[Rasputin]

"not clutch" 3:51 vs saints

[Rasputin]

Chiefs' Patrick Mahomes, Mecole Hardman address shaky first quarter performance



The Kansas City Chiefs’ second win of the preseason didn’t come without some unnerving developments for the first-string offense. Most concerning was the apparent miscommunication between MVP quarterback Patrick Mahomes and starting receiver Mecole Hardman.

The third-year receiver saw eight targets in the game, with the majority of those looks coming from Mahomes in the first quarter, when there was an obvious effort to get the ball in Hardman’s hands. Whether the bigger problem was Mahomes sailing his passes, or Hardman being off on his routes is unclear, but something was definitely off between the duo that has found plenty of success over the last two years.


It’s probably a stretch to think anyone should be worried about an off night in a preseason game, but with Hardman taking on a significantly more substantial role with the departure of Sammy Watkins in the offseason, the hiccups felt especially foreboding.

His spectacular touchdown catch in the second quarter on an underthrown ball by Chad Henne made up for the first quarter difficulties, but Hardman acknowledged in his press conference that there were miscues between him and Mahomes early.

With Tyreek Hill out of the lineup, Hardman was the team’s number one receiver during first-team reps. Speaking to the media after the game about his heavy use in the first two quarters, Hardman seemed grateful for the opportunity to get some playing time in a starring role.

“We didn’t know Tyreek wasn’t playing until the start of the game,” Hardman said. “It was cool to get a lot of reps out there and get some targets and some catches.”

Asked to evaluate his performance, he seemed happy with what he was able to accomplish but admitted there was something awry between him and Mahomes early.

“It went good,” he said of his showing. “I think I could’ve caught the one in the corner of the end zone, we just had some miscommunication (between) me and (Patrick) Mahomes, but that’s why we’re out there, to get better. I came out of the break wrong, I could’ve been more square to (be able to) jump and get the ball, wherever it was at, so I kind of just got to be in a better position.”

Mahomes was a team player in his comments too, shouldering the blame for the mistakes and saying he could’ve thrown a better ball.

“The first end zone play, I probably just have to throw the ball with a little bit more touch,” he said of the near touchdown connection. “I threw a little hard. I tried to really rip it in there, and it was a little too high for him to get both his hands on it. The second one where he kind of ran across the field, it’s a play you always see us run with Tyreek (Hill), and we used to work on that timing of finding that right spot because he has to speed to beat that guy across the field. I don’t know what the other one was, but I
thought he had a good game. Obviously, there are a few mistakes here and there, but you saw he made the big play on that cover zero play where Chad (Henne) put it up for him, and you want to see those things.”

Moving on from a couple of missed passes, Mahomes emphasized that games and situations like these are normal for the preseason. Everyone is still gearing up, even if training camp has ended.

“We always talk about during training camp, and during these preseason games kind of training guys to kind of be on the same page as we are,” Mahomes said of the process. “That throw on that over route where I kind of threw it out of the back of the end zone at the end of that first drive. It’s kind of showing that that’s the spot that I kind of need him to be at that corner of the end zone. And even though he didn’t catch it, he’ll know that the next time, and I think the best thing with Mecole is that he doesn’t make the same mistake twice. He really has learned a lot being behind Tyreek and learning how to play that position.”

Both players’ comments would point towards the shaky first quarter being a routine part of the preparation process that the preseason is meant for. Even the best players look average at times, and it is always best to get the wrinkles ironed out while the games don’t count.

The duo of Mahomes and Hardman seems to be committed to getting where they need to be by September. A big season from both will quell any consternation this performance caused among fans.



They are building chemistry dipshits. Listen to Mahomes and this is preseason what its all about to learn timing and what they need to do.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Rasputin

Chiefs' Patrick Mahomes, Mecole Hardman address shaky first quarter performance



The Kansas City Chiefs’ second win of the preseason didn’t come without some unnerving developments for the first-string offense. Most concerning was the apparent miscommunication between MVP quarterback Patrick Mahomes and starting receiver Mecole Hardman.

The third-year receiver saw eight targets in the game, with the majority of those looks coming from Mahomes in the first quarter, when there was an obvious effort to get the ball in Hardman’s hands. Whether the bigger problem was Mahomes sailing his passes, or Hardman being off on his routes is unclear, but something was definitely off between the duo that has found plenty of success over the last two years.


It’s probably a stretch to think anyone should be worried about an off night in a preseason game, but with Hardman taking on a significantly more substantial role with the departure of Sammy Watkins in the offseason, the hiccups felt especially foreboding.

His spectacular touchdown catch in the second quarter on an underthrown ball by Chad Henne made up for the first quarter difficulties, but Hardman acknowledged in his press conference that there were miscues between him and Mahomes early.

With Tyreek Hill out of the lineup, Hardman was the team’s number one receiver during first-team reps. Speaking to the media after the game about his heavy use in the first two quarters, Hardman seemed grateful for the opportunity to get some playing time in a starring role.

“We didn’t know Tyreek wasn’t playing until the start of the game,” Hardman said. “It was cool to get a lot of reps out there and get some targets and some catches.”

Asked to evaluate his performance, he seemed happy with what he was able to accomplish but admitted there was something awry between him and Mahomes early.

“It went good,” he said of his showing. “I think I could’ve caught the one in the corner of the end zone, we just had some miscommunication (between) me and (Patrick) Mahomes, but that’s why we’re out there, to get better. I came out of the break wrong, I could’ve been more square to (be able to) jump and get the ball, wherever it was at, so I kind of just got to be in a better position.”

Mahomes was a team player in his comments too, shouldering the blame for the mistakes and saying he could’ve thrown a better ball.

“The first end zone play, I probably just have to throw the ball with a little bit more touch,” he said of the near touchdown connection. “I threw a little hard. I tried to really rip it in there, and it was a little too high for him to get both his hands on it. The second one where he kind of ran across the field, it’s a play you always see us run with Tyreek (Hill), and we used to work on that timing of finding that right spot because he has to speed to beat that guy across the field. I don’t know what the other one was, but I
thought he had a good game. Obviously, there are a few mistakes here and there, but you saw he made the big play on that cover zero play where Chad (Henne) put it up for him, and you want to see those things.”

Moving on from a couple of missed passes, Mahomes emphasized that games and situations like these are normal for the preseason. Everyone is still gearing up, even if training camp has ended.

“We always talk about during training camp, and during these preseason games kind of training guys to kind of be on the same page as we are,” Mahomes said of the process. “That throw on that over route where I kind of threw it out of the back of the end zone at the end of that first drive. It’s kind of showing that that’s the spot that I kind of need him to be at that corner of the end zone. And even though he didn’t catch it, he’ll know that the next time, and I think the best thing with Mecole is that he doesn’t make the same mistake twice. He really has learned a lot being behind Tyreek and learning how to play that position.”

Both players’ comments would point towards the shaky first quarter being a routine part of the preparation process that the preseason is meant for. Even the best players look average at times, and it is always best to get the wrinkles ironed out while the games don’t count.

The duo of Mahomes and Hardman seems to be committed to getting where they need to be by September. A big season from both will quell any consternation this performance caused among fans.



They are building chemistry dipshits. Listen to Mahomes and this is preseason what its all about to learn timing and what they need to do.

Keep in mind mahomes blamed himself, not the OL, for the super bowl loss. I get your enthusiasm. I don't think many suggest he should be cut. At worst he's a valuable Swiss army knife and gadget guy. We all hope he earns his way to something better than that, but it has to be earned and he hasn't done that yet. And for year 3, even in an Andy Reid offense, it should be further along.

I am hoping he makes that leap. But like many others we haven't seen much to think he's there yet.

[Chris Meck]

I really don't get why everyone's so worried about replacing Watkins and his 37 balls.

We scored nearly 30 a game with him out, and a MASH unit up front with a rookie RB.

We'll be fine, and those balls will be distributed between Pringle, Hardman, and Robinson mostly.

[TwistedChief]

Originally Posted by Rasputin

[B][SIZE="5"]
They are building chemistry dipshits. Listen to Mahomes and this is preseason what its all about to learn timing and what they need to do.

Attempting to build chemistry is not the same thing as successfully building chemistry.

They've been at this now for 3 training camps.