Chiefs Players: Don't Blame Herm

[Brock]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

This mindset is quite fascinating to me. Many people have said they don't want Herm here next season, because they're afraid he'll win too many games and end up with an extension.

OK?

You think we could have a big turnaround, get over .500, and have a good young team (built by Herm). But you don't want the guy that made that happen? You're afraid we'd eventually lose in the playoffs? We've only been to the playoffs twice in the last decade, but another playoff appearance wouldn't be good enough for you? For shit's sake.... I think the only way some people will be happy is if a new coach came in and took us to the Superbowl the first year with every draft pick in the pro bowl.... No time for progress, we can't be losing a playoff game... that'd be terrible...

I just can't understand how you can wish for a coach to get fired because you're afraid he'll win too many games next year and deserve a contract extension... That's just putting dislike for the guy ahead of the team's progress....

I think you'll get another season just like this one if Herm is brought back. That's why I don't want him brought back. He's a bad gameday coach.

[Reerun_KC]

Originally Posted by Brock

I think you'll get another season just like this one if Herm is brought back. That's why I don't want him brought back. He's a bad gameday coach.

Agree, it just further sets the development back even more.. Hell Herm and Gun cant even develop all the first day talent on the Dline...

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Brock

I think you'll get another season just like this one if Herm is brought back. That's why I don't want him brought back. He's a bad gameday coach.

OK. I can understand that perfectly. But I still don't get the people who are afraid of Herm coming back and winning so many games that he might be kept around.

And I've always believed that "gameday coaching" from the head coach is overrated. It's a professional team. The head coach is there on gameday for motivation and guidance. That's why he's on the sideline and not upstairs watching the plays develop. The coordinators do that. They call the plays, and they have the ability to change the scheme when necessary. That doesn't resolve Herm of some of the gameday mistakes he's made, but I question whether a different coach in the same situation would have made any huge difference. When it comes down to it, the coach can say whatever he wants. But the players have to execute on the field. And no amount of coaching can force the players to execute. Without execution on the field, coaching in itself is helpless. And with a team this young, you're not going to have all the players executing well at the same time. It's part of being inexperienced.

[crazycoffey]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

OK. I can understand that perfectly. But I still don't get the people who are afraid of Herm coming back and winning so many games that he might be kept around.

And I've always believed that "gameday coaching" from the head coach is overrated. It's a professional team. The head coach is there on gameday for motivation and guidance. That's why he's on the sideline and not upstairs watching the plays develop. The coordinators do that. They call the plays, and they have the ability to change the scheme when necessary. That doesn't resolve Herm of some of the gameday mistakes he's made, but I question whether a different coach in the same situation would have made any huge difference. When it comes down to it, the coach can say whatever he wants. But the players have to execute on the field. And no amount of coaching can force the players to execute. Without execution on the field, coaching in itself is helpless. And with a team this young, you're not going to have all the players executing well at the same time. It's part of being inexperienced.

you are going to piss off the meccamists....

[crazycoffey]

Originally Posted by Brock

I think you'll get another season just like this one if Herm is brought back. That's why I don't want him brought back. He's a bad gameday coach.

what mistake did he make this weekend, on the sideline - gameday.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

what mistake did he make this weekend, on the sideline - gameday.

I don't know, I'm not basing my comments off of one game.

[crazycoffey]

Originally Posted by Brock

I don't know, I'm not basing my comments off of one game.

ok then, the last three games, or are you only going to base your opinion off of a couple games last year, when he F'ed the clock mangement.

Truth - he's not making the same "gameday" mistakes but he's still getting the blame for them, right?

+and again, I'm really only throwing off the lynch mob this site has turned into. If he goes, I won't be sad. I have said that I'm tired of all the start overs, three years running.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

ok then, the last three games, or are you only going to base your opinion off of a couple games last year, when he F'ed the clock mangement.

Truth - he's not making the same "gameday" mistakes but he's still getting the blame for them, right?

+and again, I'm really only throwing off the lynch mob this site has turned into. If he goes, I won't be sad. I have said that I'm tired of all the start overs, three years running.

He has made some questionable decisions this year. Off the top of my head he had a couple of relatively short 4th downs and didn't go for them thus putting it in the defenses hand to win the game when they couldn't stop anybody all day long.

[crazycoffey]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

He has made some questionable decisions this year. Off the top of my head he had a couple of relatively short 4th downs and didn't go for them thus putting it in the defenses hand to win the game when they couldn't stop anybody all day long.

You miss my my point. Last year there were bigger questions, this year there are fewer, and no Herm hater want's to admit that. So the "horrible gameday coach" excuse carries little water.

He HAS had some bad days on that sideline, no question. And by the very nature of humanity - he's going to make other mistakes, everyone does. But when you can see improvements, then you don't keep bringing up the old mistakes. No relationship with work, spouse, family will ever be successful with that mentality.

-again, Herm stays or herm goes <>= to me, overall. Just pointing out other sides of the coin. If a new GM keeps him I'm ok with that, in fact more likely interested in the continuation of what started this year, but understand it if a new GM takes him out.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

You miss my my point. Last year there were bigger questions, this year there are fewer, and no Herm hater want's to admit that. So the "horrible gameday coach" excuse carries little water.

He HAS had some bad days on that sideline, no question. And by the very nature of humanity - he's going to make other mistakes, everyone does. But when you can see improvements, then you don't keep bringing up the old mistakes. No relationship with work, spouse, family will ever be successful with that mentality.

-again, Herm stays or herm goes <>= to me, overall. Just pointing out other sides of the coin. If a new GM keeps him I'm ok with that, in fact more likely interested in the continuation of what started this year, but understand it if a new GM takes him out.

I consider not going for a short 4th down and thus costing us a win a pretty horrible decision. I remember yelling at the TV at the time what an idiot he was for putting the game in the D's hand. He has done this a couple of times this season.

But as far as the TO's go and stuff like that I haven't seen that bad side of Herm since he has been here except for the occasional incident. This year he has been a ton better with reviews that is for sure.

INMVHO the main reasons why Herm should be fired is his 14-27 record in 3 years and his inability to fix the D like he said he would.

[Otter]

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

ok then, the last three games, or are you only going to base your opinion off of a couple games last year, when he F'ed the clock mangement.

Truth - he's not making the same "gameday" mistakes but he's still getting the blame for them, right?

+and again, I'm really only throwing off the lynch mob this site has turned into. If he goes, I won't be sad. I have said that I'm tired of all the start overs, three years running.

What about those of us who just think his philosophy is outdated and don't like him because of it?

[crazycoffey]

Originally Posted by Otter

What about those of us who just think his philosophy is outdated and don't like him because of it?

You are entitled to your opinion. But how outdated is it really? just because it hasn't worked to date? It's remarkably similiar to the giants and the colts

[Fish]

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

what mistake did he make this weekend, on the sideline - gameday.

Or last weekend against Sad Diego. What mistake directly attributable to Herm made the difference in the game? This was asked last week, and nobody could provide an answer beyond "Herm sucks"....

[kcfanXIII]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

Or last weekend against Sad Diego. What mistake directly attributable to Herm made the difference in the game? This was asked last week, and nobody could provide an answer beyond "Herm sucks"....

head coach is the one ultimatly responsible for wins and losses. they are in charge of game planning. if you blame the execution of the players, well, they're herm's players so again falls on him.

how many second half points have we scored in the last two weeks, or a better question is how many second half points have we given up all season. how many leads have slipped away? in indy in '06, how many times was LJ ran right up the center or guard's ass? why does he stick with the cover 2? (its well known cover 2 won't work without pass rush, and we traded that away.)

[Fish]

Originally Posted by kcfanXIII

head coach is the one ultimatly responsible for wins and losses. they are in charge of game planning. if you blame the execution of the players, well, they're herm's players so again falls on him.

how many second half points have we scored in the last two weeks, or a better question is how many second half points have we given up all season. how many leads have slipped away? in indy in '06, how many times was LJ ran right up the center or guard's ass? why does he stick with the cover 2? (its well known cover 2 won't work without pass rush, and we traded that away.)

The coach is certainly responsible for wins and losses. But that has to come with some understanding of what the team makeup is, and the level of talent currently on the team. You have to factor in the team youth and inexperience. You could pick your favorite head coach and put him in charge of the youngest team in the league, and his record would be less than his coaching average. Lots of people point to the overall record as proof positive of failure, but you have to keep in mind what the expectations were before the season started. Most everyone saw what the team was going to be made of before the season started and picked us to win 0-5 games. Now our 2 wins are being held as justification for failure, even though it was seen as expected growing pains beforehand.

Second half point are a concern. But I see us doing the same things in the second half that we're doing in the first, and not executing them the same way. LJ is no longer running up the center's ass, so that has changed since last year. Cover 2 is a failure with this personnel, and a big negative on Herm's philosophy.