Warren signs with Donks

[kczoo]

Film @ 11

[keg in kc]

The more I think about it the less I'm concerned about the d-line. Depth at nose tackle is my biggest question. Gregg's the first nose tackle they've had, in my mind; never really thought Edwards fit there. Powe's in the mix there. I don't expect him to start, but I do expect him to get worked in over the course of the year. If they can get anything out of Toribio they should be fine. The have a ton of young ends and tweeners. Dorsey will obviously start. Jackson if he's back up to speed. Gilberry will be in the mix somewhere. Then there's Bailey and apparently Miller (expected him to be a LB but maybe he's the new Gilberry while the old Gilberry is a 3-down lineman now).

I think they're still missing the tweener to take Smith's place, but they found him for change last offseason, so hopefully they can pull something off this year, too.

[TEX]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

The more I think about it the less I'm concerned about the d-line. Depth at nose tackle is my biggest question. Gregg's the first nose tackle they've had, in my mind; never really thought Edwards fit there. Powe's in the mix there. I don't expect him to start, but I do expect him to get worked in over the course of the year. If they can get anything out of Toribio they should be fine. The have a ton of young ends and tweeners. Dorsey will obviously start. Jackson if he's back up to speed. Gilberry will be in the mix somewhere. Then there's Bailey and apparently Miller (expected him to be a LB but maybe he's the new Gilberry while the old Gilberry is a 3-down lineman now).

I think they're still missing the tweener to take Smith's place, but they found him for change last offseason, so hopefully they can pull something off this year, too.

+1

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

The more I think about it the less I'm concerned about the d-line. Depth at nose tackle is my biggest question. Gregg's the first nose tackle they've had, in my mind; never really thought Edwards fit there. Powe's in the mix there. I don't expect him to start, but I do expect him to get worked in over the course of the year. If they can get anything out of Toribio they should be fine. The have a ton of young ends and tweeners. Dorsey will obviously start. Jackson if he's back up to speed. Gilberry will be in the mix somewhere. Then there's Bailey and apparently Miller (expected him to be a LB but maybe he's the new Gilberry while the old Gilberry is a 3-down lineman now).

I think they're still missing the tweener to take Smith's place, but they found him for change last offseason, so hopefully they can pull something off this year, too.

They need someone who can actually anchor that DE spot and right now they have 1 guy with potential but he's a rook (Bailey) and another guy who's made getting pushed 2-5 yards off the LOS a favorite hobby of his.

Then they have a 35 year old Gregg who played second fiddle to a 350 lb Ravens superstar and now they're asking him to be "the man".

Not to mention they still haven't found the answer at OLB.

We're what, 2 weeks away from the first preseason game and we have exactly the same holes that we started with +1.

Yeah...I don't feel good about this at all.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Pittsie

The Lawson move is less defensible, as neither Stude or Houston are proven commodities. But Franklin vs. Gregg is a closer call, if for no other reason that Gregg was in demand as a starter and Franklin will be competing for PT with Shaun Rogers.

Now, if Pioli doesn't upgrade off of Thomas Jones, add a swing tackle, and a backup DL (e.g., Jamal Anderson), I'd grade the offseason out as a D.

Regarding Brees' point, the Chiefs were in transition in 2009. Clark Hunt throwing money at the mostly brokedick players listed below wouldn't have improved their result significantly. Moreover, it's always easier to recruit FA to teams with superstar QBs that have won a SB.

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story/...hty-impressive

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Gregg sign for about 1/2 of what Franklin signed for?

Don't you think Franklin would've been in higher demand than Gregg had he gone out there with the same contractual demands as him? Franklin mis-read the market; I think it's more than fair to at least consider the possibility that Pioli did the same. I think both parties overplayed their hands pretty badly.

And you're right to the extent that Pioli didn't really have a lot of options in '09. That said - perception is reality among NFL players. The longer it goes with the Chiefs passing on guys like Lawson and Harris (another really bad miss) with the only outward explanation being $$$, the harder and harder its going to be for them to get guys here without overpaying for them.

A perfect example is in Philly - the Eagles investment in Asomugha paid immediate dividends by improving their reputation among players. Were guys really talking about Philly as some destination franchise before they came out of nowhere and snaked Nnamdi? Suddenly guys like Harris are signing there for less than they could've grabbed elsewhere.

The Chiefs could make the playoffs this season, break through and be on their way. That said, they could also slip back again, further cement that reputation and get closer to being the Royals of the NFL. Pioli has had ample opportunity to make the former more likely than the latter (even incrementally so) and has not done so. That bothers me.

[notorious]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

We're what, 2 weeks away from the first preseason game and we have exactly the same holes that we started with +1.

It's all moot until we fix the number 1 hole.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

They need someone who can actually anchor that DE spot and right now they have 1 guy with potential but he's a rook (Bailey) and another guy who's made getting pushed 2-5 yards off the LOS a favorite hobby of his.

Then they have a 35 year old Gregg who played second fiddle to a 350 lb Ravens superstar and now they're asking him to be "the man".

Not to mention they still haven't found the answer at OLB.

We're what, 2 weeks away from the first preseason game and we have exactly the same holes that we started with +1.

Yeah...I don't feel good about this at all.

How is replacing Edwards with Gregg not fixing a hole? And did you really think we'd have an answer at OLB before preseason games started? When we drafted Houston, everyone knew it would be a competition between him and Studebaker. So of course they haven't found an answer yet. They've been in camp for less than a week.

I'm not worried about the D-line. I'd take Gregg over Edwards any day at any age.

[Mile High Mania]

You guys are trashing what was a perfectly good Broncos' bashing thread... please step away.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

They need someone who can actually anchor that DE spot and right now they have 1 guy with potential but he's a rook (Bailey) and another guy who's made getting pushed 2-5 yards off the LOS a favorite hobby of his.

Jackson will be fine. If he's not, Gilberry will take his job. Bailey's the other depth.

That's the way I see it at least.

Then they have a 35 year old Gregg who played second fiddle to a 350 lb Ravens superstar and now they're asking him to be "the man".

One of my fantasies is that they land Ngata next offseason, but I'd say the odds of that are slim.

As far as Gregg being 35, there may not be a position anywhere on the field where age means less than nose tackle. My belief is that he's going to be an improvement over Edwards, quite possibly a massive one. We haven't had a player here like him before. His weight isn't that much more than Edwards was, but he's much lower to the ground and difficult to move. I never understood playing Edwards at the nose, never thought he fit the position. Gregg does.

Not to mention they still haven't found the answer at OLB.

Maybe they have, maybe they haven't. Kind of hard to tell when Hali's sitting home and Houston's off doing...whatever it is he's doing right now. I'm not the biggest Studebaker fan, but I'd like to think between him, Houston and Sheffield they can match Vrabel's talent on the field, such as it was. Leadership is another issue. But that's another thread.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

You guys are trashing what was a perfectly good Broncos' bashing thread... please step away.

Don't get me wrong - I totally hope that Ty Warren dies in a fire.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by -King-

How is replacing Edwards with Gregg not fixing a hole? And did you really think we'd have an answer at OLB before preseason games started? When we drafted Houston, everyone knew it would be a competition between him and Studebaker. So of course they haven't found an answer yet. They've been in camp for less than a week.

I'm not worried about the D-line. I'd take Gregg over Edwards any day at any age.

Gregg is 35 years old and was a back up. He didn't have to endure all the snaps in a full season. We don't know how effective he'll be late in the season. He's a question mark and I don't really feel all that comfortable calling him an upgrade yet.

And Houston isn't even in camp yet. Each passing day that goes by Studebaker takes another sigh of relief. Right now there is no competition. Lawson made so much sense at that spot.....They couldn't get him for a 1 yr contract? C'mon....


Ok, ok, fine. I get it. They're building the team through the draft, developing their core players and locking them up, blah blah.

If so, then why the **** does Carr not have a new contract yet? Hali? Two core members of our D are looking at holding out.

Not happy with the Chiefs right now.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

Jackson will be fine. If he's not, Gilberry will take his job. Bailey's the other depth.

That's the way I see it at least. One of my fantasies is that they land Ngata next offseason, but I'd say the odds of that are slim.

As far as Gregg being 35, there may not be a position anywhere on the field where age means less than nose tackle. My belief is that he's going to be an improvement over Edwards, quite possibly a massive one. We haven't had a player here like him before. His weight isn't that much more than Edwards was, but he's much lower to the ground and difficult to move. I never understood playing Edwards at the nose, never thought he fit the position. Gregg does.Maybe they have, maybe they haven't. Kind of hard to tell when Hali's sitting home and Houston's off doing...whatever it is he's doing right now. I'm not the biggest Studebaker fan, but I'd like to think between him, Houston and Sheffield they can match Vrabel's talent on the field, such as it was. Leadership is another issue. But that's another thread.

Jackson has shown us nothing to make me believe he'll be fine. Nothing. 1 good half in 2 seasons validates shit IMO. And I disagree about age and NT's.

NTs get smashed on. Is there another position that takes on more 2-300 pounders a game then NT?

[kysirsoze]

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

You guys are trashing what was a perfectly good Broncos' bashing thread... please step away.

Thank you! JFC, guys. Let's have some ****ing perspective.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

J I'm not the biggest Studebaker fan, but I'd like to think between him, Houston and Sheffield they can match Vrabel's talent on the field, such as it was. Leadership is another issue. But that's another thread.

That's one piss-poor bar to set, is it not? Vrabel or Stude is a false choice; the market left a bunch of other available options for us. Do you believe Stude/Sheffield/Houston could approach Lawson's talent on the field? And Lawson's been known as a good character guy in his own right.

If we get Roth, I'll be less frustrated by this offseason in that it will suggest that the Chiefs determined that Lawson just wasn't as good a fit as Roth. But I don't see anything to suggest we'll get Roth. I fully expect him to sign a 1 year deal for less than $3 million somewhere and we'll run 'the kids' out there and likely lose a game on account of it.

[keg in kc]

There's a reason you see more linemen playing into their mid- to late 30s than you do receivers or backs. Technique and experience can mean a whole lot.

We'll see on Jackson. Like I said, if he doesn't perform, I think the newly 280-pound Gilberry takes his job. I think there's a decent chance Jackson's fine, though, as a 3rd year player who may finally have a sense of urgency about his job in the league. We'll see. Admittedly, I've always been somebody willing to wait on a player to develop. I think fans have a tendency to make their minds up on players (positively or negatively) too quickly.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Gregg is 35 years old and was a back up.

Yeah... but he wasn't.

And Houston isn't even in camp yet. Each passing day that goes by Studebaker takes another sigh of relief. Right now there is no competition. Lawson made so much sense at that spot.....They couldn't get him for a 1 yr contract? C'mon....

Why did he make so much more sense there? Because he was a vet? If Houston is coming in, I'd rather have him. Do people forget that Houston was supposed to be a 1st round pick?

If so, then why the **** does Carr not have a new contract yet? Hali? Two core members of our D are looking at holding out.

Not happy with the Chiefs right now.

Those are the only 2 issues I see so far. But Carr is signing tomorrow, and hali will likely be in later in the week.