I owe Kyle Orton an apology...

[htismaqe]

and quite a few people here should be doling them out as well...

Leonard Pope? Big catches. Barry Richardson? Nice job.

Same cast of characters, same playcalling (McCluster up the middle, anyone?)...

Yet Orton has 300 yards passing in a game where we led the entire way.

Yeah, I wanted to see Stanzi play and I still do.

But thank you Kyle Orton for making it ABUNDANTLY clear how much of a waste Matt Cassel is...

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by SenselessChiefsFan

I just don't think that Orton is any better.

You said he couldn't replicate what he did in Denver without McDaniels.

Today he played EXACTLY like he did in Denver last season.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by SenselessChiefsFan

@SD
Minnesota
@Indy.

All better games this year, without Charles and saddled with Haley on the sideline.

Orton didn't throw a TD.

But, don't let the facts get in the way of anyones opinion.

His numbers in those games are comparable, but he was crap in the first half against both Indy, the worst team in the league, and against Minnesota.

He threw for more TDs, but most were the result of the receivers making great efforts on YAC.

One was piss poor throw that Bowe made a play on and ran through the defense.

Orton's throws were delivered accurately and on time.

Not once has Cassel been able to do that.

[BigMeatballDave]

Originally Posted by SenselessChiefsFan

Once again, perception isn't reality. It happens a lot around here.

Senseless Chiefs fan is ****ing senseless

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Originally Posted by mcan

Orton played a great game and is clearly an upgrade over Cassel. But the biggest difference out there today was the way the offense was set up. We ran screens with O-linemen lead blocking against blitzes, giving our guys space 4 times today (three of them were successful). We haven't done that ALL YEAR. Not once, did we throw a shitty bobble screen to a wr, and just hope that the slot could make a block against a corner in press coverage. We only threw the wr screen twice, but NEVER relied on that low percentage block. We just took it when their guys were playing off. We also better utilized our TEs and got them up the seems against zone defenses and used the deep middle part of the field. By doing so, we were able to neutralize the opponents blitzes and make them play honestly (instead of going max protect and trying to BLOCK 7 and 8 man blitzes). our offensive line ran TRAPS today, on a lot of runs that weren't counters. We also actually PITCHED the ball a few times, instead of just running stretches, which gave our running backs a chance to use efficient footwork to catch the corner, instead of making them footRACE to the sideline. This offense looked like a professional offense, not just in execution but in preparation and style. It's VERY clear that Haley's system of offense was dragging everybody down, and now that the cancer has been removed, we can start actually evaluating what we have.

All good points.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by SenselessChiefsFan

I wish Haley was still here, so that we could actually judge Orton in the same situation.

I have said ALL along, for a long time, that Cassel is average, Haley makes him and the entire offense less than average.

Either way, Crennel got more out of this team than Haley did all season.

I wanted Haley gone. I am fine with Cassel leaving. I just don't think that Orton is any better.

I agree with pretty much everything you said here except your last sentence. Orton is so much better than Cassel it is not even close

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by mcan

We ran screens with O-linemen lead blocking against blitzes, giving our guys space 4 times today (three of them were successful). We haven't done that ALL YEAR.

I mentioned it in another thread - the first screen to McClain was almost identical to the one we ran in the gold zone against Minnesota, which ended with Cassel throwing it into the dirt. Sorry but we HAVE done it, several times. Cassel just can't execute.

Originally Posted by mcan

Not once, did we throw a shitty bobble screen to a wr, and just hope that the slot could make a block against a corner in press coverage. We only threw the wr screen twice, but NEVER relied on that low percentage block. We just took it when their guys were playing off.

You do realize that those plays rely on a pre-snap read by the QB, right? So the reason we did it today when they played off was BECAUSE OF ORTON.

[jd1020]

Originally Posted by SenselessChiefsFan

I wish Haley was still here, so that we could actually judge Orton in the same situation.

I have said ALL along, for a long time, that Cassel is average, Haley makes him and the entire offense less than average.

Either way, Crennel got more out of this team than Haley did all season.

I wanted Haley gone. I am fine with Cassel leaving. I just don't think that Orton is any better.

I wish you left with Haley.

[baitism]

Yes, statistically GB has a bad defense because teams are always passing because they are playing from behind. Don't kid yourself into thinking they are actually one of the worst in the league. Stats can lie.

[scho63]

Originally Posted by Dave

We are arguing Orton vs Cassel, dumbass.

So far he looks great but one game is still one game. If he throws 4 INTS next week everyone will swing back the other way.

He definitely throws a stronger ball than Cassel

[Mr. Laz]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

same playcalling (McCluster up the middle, anyone?)...

bullshit ... playcalling was nothing like it has been

did we run a DMC draw at all?

our redzone playcalling sucked but other than that Muir > Haley

[Coogs]

Originally Posted by JCharles1981

I am not putting my trust in Kyle Orton until I see what he does next year. Having him start the last 3 games of this season isn't enough for me to make a judgment call on whether or not he can spark a fire into the Chiefs' offense. Remember how excited many of us were when Dick Vermeil became the Head Coach during the first half of the last decade, and then were bummed when we only made it to the playoffs once in the 5 years he was with us? Don't cross your fingers just yet.

3 games are going to be all you get. Orton's contract is up at the end of the season. Either you resign him or don't based off of 3 games. Game 1 goes in favor of Orton.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Originally Posted by milkman

His numbers in those games are comparable, but he was crap in the first half against both Indy, the worst team in the league, and against Minnesota.

He threw for more TDs, but most were the result of the receivers making great efforts on YAC.

One was piss poor throw that Bowe made a play on and ran through the defense.

Orton's throws were delivered accurately and on time.

Not once has Cassel been able to do that.

The offense was actually quite a bit different. It allowed the QB to have more time and give the WR's more time to get open.

I am kind of sick of arguing.

Cassel isn't great, he just isn't as bad as the guys on here think.

And, forgive me for not wanting to change my opinion of Orton after one game against a bad defense.

I have seen Orton for five years. One year doesn't completely change history.

[Rams Fan]

Originally Posted by scho63

So far he looks great but one game is still one game. If he throws 4 INTS next week everyone will swing back the other way.

He definitely throws a stronger ball than Cassel

Orton is and will always be better than Cassel.

[Buckweath]

Originally Posted by KCBOSS1

If Orton plays out the rest of the season like he did today, he deserves the starting job hands down with no concern for "competition". I wasn't an Orton supporter but after not having a real quarterback in this offense since Trent Green, the potential of this team looks completely different with him in there. I believe a win like this could absolutely bond players with coach, with quarterback. If he continues like he did today, we should not draft a QB first round, he shouldn't have to look over his shoulder. The job should be completely his. If a highly ranked qb falls to a lower round, that's different.

TERRIBLE FAIL!!!!

Orton is an average to below average QB. One thing is for sure, he is not good enough to lead this team to a Superbowl.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by mcan

Orton played a great game and is clearly an upgrade over Cassel. But the biggest difference out there today was the way the offense was set up. We ran screens with O-linemen lead blocking against blitzes, giving our guys space 4 times today (three of them were successful). We haven't done that ALL YEAR. Not once, did we throw a shitty bobble screen to a wr, and just hope that the slot could make a block against a corner in press coverage. We only threw the wr screen twice, but NEVER relied on that low percentage block. We just took it when their guys were playing off. We also better utilized our TEs and got them up the seems against zone defenses and used the deep middle part of the field. By doing so, we were able to neutralize the opponents blitzes and make them play honestly (instead of going max protect and trying to BLOCK 7 and 8 man blitzes). our offensive line ran TRAPS today, on a lot of runs that weren't counters. We also actually PITCHED the ball a few times, instead of just running stretches, which gave our running backs a chance to use efficient footwork to catch the corner, instead of making them footRACE to the sideline. This offense looked like a professional offense, not just in execution but in preparation and style. It's VERY clear that Haley's system of offense was dragging everybody down, and now that the cancer has been removed, we can start actually evaluating what we have.

Screens were successful today because the Pack defense had to actually respect Orton's ability to hit the deep balls, including the seam routes over the middle.

The Pack couldn't just line up everyone within 10 yards of the LOS and dare the QB to beat 'em deep.