We are not taking a QB in the first round

[TheGuardian]

Just the official thread stating it. I'm not sure why some of you are already blowing this horn.

Just keep reading the title of this thread until it ****ing sinks in.

And I'm not even a Cassel fan, but he's going to be given more than 1 season to show he is or is not the guy.

I know all the bullshit arguments that will come forth.

"He's not a rookie, he's a seasoned vet" blah blah ****ing blah. I don't give a shit. I'm talking about reality. They gave him 60 mil. Even if Cassel never improves on this season (which I actually think he will, even if I'm not a fan), GM's don't admit to failures that quickly. Pioli will give him every chance to prove that he's right. He drafted him, he signed him to a 60 million dollar contract. Those of you you think that Pioli is going to turn right around and draft a QB with our first pick are ****ing morons. Yes, you are. It's ENTIRELY out of the question so please stop wasting discussion time with it.

Thank you and have a nice new years day.

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

This stuff isn't new.

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/l...iving&rank=232

Bowe is tied with the league lead in drops with 11; the person whom he shares this honor with is Vernon Davis.

Some notables:

Dallas Clark with 9
TO with 9
Colston with 8
Gates with 7
Andre Johnson with 7
Marshall with 7
Moss with 7
Mason with 7

Look, have the Chiefs WRs performed poorly? Absolutely. No question, and they figure prominently on the above list.

But what's also NOT new is that WRs who get a lot of targets also tend to lead the league in drops.

And if you're arguing that the criticism of Cassel is generally too black and white, then we have to take the same type of critical eye to the problems with the WRs this year. Maybe, just maybe, having a sub-par QB is a factor.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

We're on a record pace for the number of dropped passes in a season......but yeah it's all because Cassel can't read a defense.

This board is so filled with stupid sometimes it hurts.

Yeah... Brady can't read defenses or throw for shit, either, and that's why Galloway was dropping those passes earlier this year.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/l...iving&rank=232

Bowe is tied with the league lead in drops with 11; the person whom he shares this honor with is Vernon Davis.

Some notables:

Dallas Clark with 9
TO with 9
Colston with 8
Gates with 7
Andre Johnson with 7
Marshall with 7
Moss with 7
Mason with 7

Look, have the Chiefs WRs performed poorly? Absolutely. No question, and they figure prominently on the above list.

But what's also NOT new is that WRs who get a lot of targets also tend to lead the league in drops.

And if you're arguing that the criticism of Cassel is generally too black and white, then we have to take the same type of critical eye to the problems with the WRs this year. Maybe, just maybe, having a sub-par is a factor.

No, I'm arguing that people such as yourself have lost your minds on the Cassel issue. Cassel is not the one dropping the passes. He's not the one failing to block. He's not the one who's unable to get open. He is, however, the one who's play is dependent upon those other things being done correctly. What's happening to Cassel is what happens to quarterbacks when their team sucks.

This season has gone pretty much as people should have expected, and at pretty much every position on the team. Massive turnover of a team that was already bereft of talent was all but guaranteed to result in uneven results.

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

No, I'm arguing that people such as yourself have lost your minds on the Cassel issue. Cassel is not the one dropping the passes. He's not the one failing to block. He's not the one who's unable to get open. He is, however, the one who's play is dependent upon those other things being done correctly. What's happening to Cassel is what happens to quarterbacks when their team sucks.

This season has gone pretty much as people should have expected, and at pretty much every position on the team. Massive turnover of a team that was already bereft of talent was all but guaranteed to result in uneven results.

Wow.

Because drops are a black and white statistic. There are no variables. The WRs are dependent upon nothing.

The QB, on the other hand, is always the victim of circumstances. He is NEVER a source of a problem. Never. Not a factor.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

And if you're arguing that the criticism of Cassel is generally too black and white, then we have to take the same type of critical eye to the problems with the WRs this year. Maybe, just maybe, having a sub-par is a factor.

I've made this comment before, but it's very hard for me to get an honest read on Cassel when the whole unit is sub-par. We have one of the worst lines in the league, featuring at most two guys who'd be starting anywhere else in the NFL, and one of them is an older player on the decline. We have a group of tight ends taken off the waiver wire, all except for Cottem rejects from other teams. We have a group of wide receivers taken off the waiver wire, all except for Bowe rejects from other teams. We have Charles at running back, who's shown himself to be the one clearly legitimate threat on this roster, and a bunch of nobodies, including fullbacks all taken off the waiver wire.

This may, literally, be the worst collection of talent I've ever seen. We're talking about the equivalent of the roster for Greg Robinson's defense shortly after the turn of the century when he was running guys like Mike Maslowski and William Bartee and Glenn Cadrez and Ray Crockett and Marvcus Patton out there.

It's that bad, I think, as a unit. And I know I'm the only person in the entire midwest who probably believes this, but I think it's in some ways a testament to Haley that they've actually managed to score as much as they have with the players they're putting on the field, particularly with the the change in scheme the week before the season and then the revolving personnel door all year long. Hell, by all rights they should be even worse. It's like taking a cap gun into a combat zone.

So the only thing I know right now about Cassel is that he's not able to give a pro bowl performance with a Pop-warner roster. I stilldon't have any idea what he'd look like with an actual NFL calibre roster around him. Maybe he'd be awful, I just don't know one way or the other.

But I figure we're going to find out eventually. Personally I didn't want Cassel, but the trade was made whether I liked it or not, and odds are he's going to have at least another year at the helm. That's just the reality of it. Now I hope the next part of their plan is to actually put a couple of good offensive players on the field at the same time sometime in the next decade.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

Wow.

Because drops are a black and white statistic. There are no variables. The WRs are dependent upon nothing.

The QB, on the other hand, is always the victim of circumstances. He is NEVER a source of a problem. Never. Not a factor.

Again, the receivers' problems with drops were well documented before they ever had Cassel throwing them the ball. So, knowing that, are you saying that it's Cassel's fault that receivers can't get open?

[RustShack]

The Chiefs line isn't nearly as bad as people are claiming... I can understand thinking that if you quit watching half way through the season but its really not the case anymore... we still NEED a RG and C bad but still..

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Again, the receivers' problems with drops were well documented before they ever had Cassel throwing them the ball.

Two weeks ago, I believe, Charles recorded a "drop" in the endzone. The pass was abysmal.

Mike Cox had a "drop" to start this same game. Again, more the result of a poor pass than anything else.

Most of the receivers I listed in my previous post were high on the drops list in '08, too. Shockingly, high targets lead to higher numbers of drops.

Which, again, is subjectively tallied. And this isn't a QB-driven league, so there's little reason to believe that this trust-worthy statistic would be skewed in the interest of a cheap, inconsequential position.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by RustShack

The Chiefs line isn't nearly as bad as people are claiming... I can understand thinking that if you quit watching half way through the season but its really not the case anymore... we still NEED a RG and C bad but still..

They're playing somewhat better, but that's not saying a whole lot from where they started. In terms of personnel, I think they're still one of the worst in the league and need a complete overhaul for 2010. I'd say anybody other than Albert should be expendable, and he's only kept as a high draft pick and for future potential.

Basically what I mean is that the goal here shouldn't be to take mediocre players and try to improve them into a collectively below average line, which is what they've done in 2009. The goal should be to get 5 good starting-calibre players and make them into one of the top lines in the league. Dick Vermeil had that part of it right, I think.

How they do that, I don't know. But by no means should the 2010 line even remotely resemble the 2009 one, not if they want to win...anything.

Maybe the same can be said for Cassel. Like I said, I don't know. What I do know is that he's under a pretty serious contract and, much like my mention of Albert, the likelihood is that the job's his, whether you, me, or anybody else likes it or not...

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

Two weeks ago, I believe, Charles recorded a "drop" in the endzone. The pass was abysmal.

Mike Cox had a "drop" to start this same game. Again, more the result of a poor pass than anything else.

Most of the receivers I listed in my previous post were high on the drops list in '08, too. Shockingly, high targets lead to higher numbers of drops.

Which, again, is subjectively tallied. And this isn't a QB-driven league, so there's little reason to believe that this trust-worthy statistic would be skewed in the interest of a cheap, inconsequential position.

There will be passes that aren't called drops when they should be, too. It's the nature of the statistic. You can keep ignoring reality and looking for the rare exceptions in order to bitch about Cassel, or you can start making honest evaluations. That's your choice.

The reality is that Cassel has had to deal with a wide receiver carousel of players who've had issues with drops before playing with Cassel. Some of the receivers weren't even on the team to start the year. Receivers have had to play different roles because of things like Bowe getting a 4 game suspension. The team's best receiver from last year isn't even on the team this year, and the team's second best receiver from last year is dealing with different defensive scheming as a result, and it's clearly had an impact upon his game. Whether you care to admit it or not, this stuff has an impact upon even the best quarterbacks.

And this isn't even addressing the impact of a poor running game and poor offensive line work.

[Chiefspants]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/l...iving&rank=232

Bowe is tied with the league lead in drops with 11; the person whom he shares this honor with is Vernon Davis.

Some notables:

Dallas Clark with 9
TO with 9
Colston with 8
Gates with 7
Andre Johnson with 7
Marshall with 7
Moss with 7
Mason with 7

Look, have the Chiefs WRs performed poorly? Absolutely. No question, and they figure prominently on the above list.

But what's also NOT new is that WRs who get a lot of targets also tend to lead the league in drops.

And if you're arguing that the criticism of Cassel is generally too black and white, then we have to take the same type of critical eye to the problems with the WRs this year. Maybe, just maybe, having a sub-par QB is a factor.

The problem with this list is that all of these receivers have been targeted significantly more than Bowe, lets look at the amount of receptions for each of the receivers you listed.

Davis 72
Clark 93
TO 51
Colston 69
Gates 78
Johnson 95
Marshall 101
Moss 78
Mason 72


And finally, Bowe with 46.

You find that Bowe's drops are significantly worrying when he has dropped passes at a much higher rate than any receiver this year, (Even TO, and that showboat has led the league in drops during many years of his infamous career.)

[BossChief]

There is 0% chance we take a qb with the 3rd pick of the draft to keep.

We just signed Cassel to a 63 million dollar deal.

[Mecca]

Just Passin By sounds like a Chiefs employee, No it's not Cassel's fault don't look here, over there quick!

I also enjoy his propensity to personally insult those who are actually Chiefs fans when he's only here because of Pioli.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Just Passin By sounds like a Chiefs employee, No it's not Cassel's fault don't look here, over there quick!

You must have missed

Yes, the quarterback needs to play better.

It's shocking that you would skip the stuff that undermines your assertions.

Originally Posted by Mecca

I also enjoy his propensity to personally insult those who are actually Chiefs fans when he's only here because of Pioli.

Throwing out the red herring again, I see. What's funny about you continually tossing this out is that I'm not a Chiefs fan yet I can point to improvements and progress I see when looking at the team while you're still too busy being an asshole to honestly evaluate the team, all because your boyfriend was passed over and is now playing, poorly, for the Jets.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

You must have missed



It's shocking that you would skip the stuff that undermines your assertions.




Throwing out the red herring again, I see.

You don't insult people basically all the time?

You're a clown, you're an idiot this that and the other.

Sorry we don't share the love of the Pioli splooge and actually question his decisions.