Chiefs If the Chiefs go 8-8 or better 49ers get a 2nd round pick. [Archive] - Page 7

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 09:33 AM

I can understand that, but you are not 15 anymore. You should appreciate that just because "you missed" on one assessment in the past and "your boy" failed... that doesn't mean that every other move made will fail.

This is a quitter's mentality. Remember when you were 14, and a girl broke your heart? Did you forever after give up on the fairer sex and become parthenogenetic?

My comment had nothing to do with me "missing" an assessment and feeling bad about it, and everything to do with comparing your argument, sentiments and stance to one I took when I was 15 years old and knew jack sh*t.

Or, to put it simply: You're as big a homer for Alex Smith right now as I was for Elvis Grbac when I was a high school freshman who didn't know any better.

It's not about me. It's about you, buddy.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 09:34 AM

My comment had nothing to do with me "missing" an assessment and feeling bad about it, and everything to do with comparing your argument, sentiments and stance to one I took when I was 15 years old and knew jack sh*t.

Or, to put it simply: You're as big a homer for Alex Smith right now as I was for Elvis Grbac when I was a high school freshman who didn't know any better.

It's not about me. It's about you, buddy.

Maybe it's about you. Maybe you were wrong then and you're still wrong now.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 09:36 AM

Alex Smith is gonna be better next year than any rookie QB. And if we give up a 2nd next year it would mean we made a serious push for the playoffs.
I'd consider a first year situation like that being a huge success coming off what happened last year.
8-8 is= to a "serious push for the playoffs" in your mind?

JFC. are you serious?

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 09:37 AM

We go 8-8 and we are in the playoff race a couple weeks into December.

ROFL

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 09:38 AM

8-8 is= to a "serious push for the playoffs" in your mind?

JFC. are you serious?

I think it depends on how you get there. If you were 8-5 and lost your last 3 you made a push. If you are 5-8 and win your last 3 then you won some meaningless games and were never in contention. But with what the Chiefs are doing 8-8 is a failure regardless of how you get there.

If you are only starting 2-3 rookie/2nd year guys you need to be making the playoffs.

-King-

05-13-2013, 09:39 AM

LMAO This is just comical now.
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patteeu

05-13-2013, 09:39 AM

I think it depends on how you get there. If you were 8-5 and lost your last 3 you made a push. If you are 5-8 and win your last 3 then you won some meaningless games and were never in contention.

This is a good point.

-King-

05-13-2013, 09:40 AM

We trade for a 29 year old 8 year vet and 8-8 is still our aim. LMAO.
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patteeu

05-13-2013, 09:40 AM

LMAO This is just comical now.
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So is your death grip on the 8-8 thing as if Andy Reid wants to get to 8 wins and then shut it down for the season.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 09:41 AM

We trade for a 29 year old 8 year vet and 8-8 is still our aim. LMAO.
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See what I mean?

-King-

05-13-2013, 09:44 AM

See what I mean?

8-8 shouldn't even be a part of the conversation when you make a move like that. A winning season should be automatic. Playoffs should be a minimum when you makethat kind of trade. The fact that people are justifying 8-8 is sad.
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Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 09:45 AM

give us one good reason why a team that wanted alex smith last year wouldnt have just made an offer?

oh because the niners wanted him back, thats right.

and thats how free agency works in the nfl, right?

Because GMs of pro sports teams are altruists looking out to help opposing teams.

Don't you remember how Baltimore passed on signing Dumervil after Elvis said he wanted to play for the Miami Dolphins, his hometown team?

No?

No, because you are not stupid.

-King-

05-13-2013, 09:45 AM

I also find it funny that Patteeu has more posts about the Chiefs after the Alex Smith trade than he had all of last year and probably in all his years on CP combined. He's like one of the 49ers trolls.
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Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 09:47 AM

Yeah, because signing Kevin Kolb, or Carson Palmer, or sticking with Blaine Gabbert, are moves that should go over smooth as silk with any fan base.

For how many 2nd round draft picks?

RunKC

05-13-2013, 09:49 AM

8-8 is= to a "serious push for the playoffs" in your mind?

JFC. are you serious?

An 8-8 is usually in the playoff race until around week 15.
WTF do you want from this team next year? They were the WORST team in the league last year. You do know that right?

jd1020

05-13-2013, 09:49 AM

Well, by that time, I'm sure they knew there was a deal in place with the Chiefs. I don't think it was a league wide reaction of, No way! We don't want that piece of ****! I think any one of those teams that came out saying they had no deal with Smith, would take him over their current starter.

I dont think any of those teams are losing sleep over missing out on Alex Smith.

A stop gap is a stop gap is a stop gap.

The Chiefs just happened to pay for their stop gap like he's going to be around for the next decade because they are morons.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 09:51 AM

For how many 2nd round draft picks?

Just call it what it is. It's a 1st round pick. By calling them mulitple 2nds it seems to downgrade how much they truely invested in Alice.

-King-

05-13-2013, 09:52 AM

An 8-8 is usually in the playoff race until around week 15.
WTF do you want from this team next year? They were the WORST team in the league last year. You do know that right?

So you're saying we shouldn't be in win now mode? So why the fuck did we just pick up a 29 year old QB with a $15MM contract for 2 early draft picks?
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patteeu

05-13-2013, 09:52 AM

8-8 shouldn't even be a part of the conversation when you make a move like that. A winning season should be automatic. Playoffs should be a minimum when you makethat kind of trade. The fact that people are justifying 8-8 is sad.
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Maybe it would help you to think of the Alex Smith trade compensation as two 2nd round picks with an insurance clause reducing that second round pick if something goes catastrophically wrong (e.g. Alex has a season ending injury) and the team ends up having a losing season.

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 09:53 AM

Maybe it's about you. Maybe you were wrong then and you're still wrong now.

Guess you're missing it, too. (Shocker)

The point of my post is not about his opinions regarding Alex Smith. The point of my post is that everything about the way he approaches this topic reminds me of myself, when I was 15, supporting Elvis Grbac.

As for being wrong, I am wrong often, just like anyone without omniscience. I probably have a little bit better grasp of sports and football after covering them for 10 years, including 4 years at a national sports magazine, though...

jd1020

05-13-2013, 09:53 AM

Maybe it would help you to think of the Alex Smith trade compensation as two 2nd round picks with an insurance clause reducing that second round pick if something goes catastrophically wrong (e.g. Alex has a season ending injury) and the team ends up having a losing season.

Doesn't help at all. Because we ended up trading at least 1 2nd round pick, that just happened to be #34, for a pos and then next year we have to give them a 3rd round pick as a "Thank you for sodomizing me."

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:02 AM

Guess you're missing it, too. (Shocker)

The point of my post is not about his opinions regarding Alex Smith. The point of my post is that everything about the way he approaches this topic reminds me of myself, when I was 15, supporting Elvis Grbac.

As for being wrong, I am wrong often, just like anyone without omniscience. I probably have a little bit better grasp of sports and football after covering them for 10 years, including 4 years at a national sports magazine, though...

No, I didn't miss that. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that because you were wrong then, he's wrong now. Using an argument at the wrong time under the wrong circumstances makes you wrong. Using the same argument at the right time under the right circumstances, is a different story.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 10:02 AM

So you're saying we shouldn't be in win now mode? So why the **** did we just pick up a 29 year old QB with a $15MM contract for 2 early draft picks?
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I think they are in win now mode and want to make the playoffs. Alex Smith was the best option right now. They had no choice. I know they are in win now mode but expecting them to automatically make the playoffs is a bit pretentious.
Pioli left this regime with holes to fill in a lot of spots.
Can't expect them to be this winning team in January in year 1.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:03 AM

Doesn't help at all. Because we ended up trading at least 1 2nd round pick, that just happened to be #34, for a pos and then next year we have to give them a 3rd round pick as a "Thank you for sodomizing me."

That's just the insurance policy. The expectation is that the trade will succeed and the cost for success was two 2nds.

If you want to complain about the cost of the trade, fine, complain away. But drop this nonsense about the 8-8 escalator because it makes you guys look silly. It doesn't define what the goal is, it's just a trade factor that makes the expected cost of the trade slightly less than two 2nds instead of an even two 2nds.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:04 AM

That's just the insurance policy. The expectation is that the trade will succeed and the cost for success was two 2nds.

"Success"

LMAO

Reid and Dorsey put their best case scenario on the table with a clause of 8-8 on the 2014 pick. Just think about that for a second... 8-8.

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:08 AM

I think they are in win now mode and want to make the playoffs. Alex Smith was the best option right now. They had no choice. I know they are in win now mode but expecting them to automatically make the playoffs is a bit pretentious.
***** left this regime with holes to fill in a lot of spots.
Can't expect them to be this winning team in January in year 1.

Then making the Alex SMith move makes no sense. If you don't expect to be a playoff contender, you don't make the move giving up what you did.

If you are rebuilding, you keep the picks and go from there. If you are in win now, you give up the picks for the guy.

Which they did, therefor, I don't understand why holding them to said standard is a big deal.

It seems some here are excited, saying yes it was a win now move and are hoping and thinking they will win, yet when some say they should be held to that standard, the breaks start pumping.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:08 AM

I think they are in win now mode and want to make the playoffs. Alex Smith was the best option right now. They had no choice. I know they are in win now mode but expecting them to automatically make the playoffs is a bit pretentious.
***** left this regime with holes to fill in a lot of spots.
Can't expect them to be this winning team in January in year 1.

In keeping with a somewhat optimistic mindset, where do you feel KC is below average at this point?

I'm not really disagreeing. Going to the playoffs after a 2-14 record IS a tall order. But as I hear it from most KC fans elsewhere... their record could be mostly attributed to having poor QB play and poor coaching.

Now that this has changed.. I don't mind allowing for my natural inclination to find some optimism that KC can win 9 games. And if they do? Hey, anything can happen if that means a playoff visit.

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:16 AM

No, I didn't miss that. I just don't think there's any reason to believe that because you were wrong then, he's wrong now. Using an argument at the wrong time under the wrong circumstances makes you wrong. Using the same argument at the right time under the right circumstances, is a different story.

I'm not making a statement about right/wrong. My statement is about the way his actions, statement and level of "sold" remind me of mine back then.

That's what you're missing.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 10:18 AM

"Success"

.

:facepalm:

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:20 AM

In keeping with a somewhat optimistic mindset, where do you feel KC is below average at this point?

I'm not really disagreeing. Going to the playoffs after a 2-14 record IS a tall order. But as I hear it from most KC fans elsewhere... their record could be mostly attributed to having poor QB play and poor coaching.

Now that this has changed.. I don't mind allowing for my natural inclination to find some optimism that KC can win 9 games. And if they do? Hey, anything can happen if that means a playoff visit.

Below average?

Quarterback (Alex Smith 15th-20th best-QB in NFL)
Defensive line (lot of question marks and potential holes)

They're above average at P, OL, RB, LB, one CB and one S spot, for sure. Question marks at CBs 2 and 3 and Ss 2 and 3.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 10:21 AM

Just call it what it is. It's a 1st round pick. By calling them mulitple 2nds it seems to downgrade how much they truely invested in Alice.

My point was those teams gave up nothing for their dregs.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:21 AM

An 8-8 is usually in the playoff race until around week 15.
WTF do you want from this team next year? They were the WORST team in the league last year. You do know that right?

i want to see them building this team into a consistent super bowl contender.

if they had gotten a young Qb record wouldnt matter.

trading for an older guy means they should be contending right away.

and to me 8-8 isnt a contending team

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:22 AM

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:22 AM

Then making the Alex SMith move makes no sense. If you don't expect to be a playoff contender, you don't make the move giving up what you did.

If you are rebuilding, you keep the picks and go from there. If you are in win now, you give up the picks for the guy.

Which they did, therefor, I don't understand why holding them to said standard is a big deal.

It seems some here are excited, saying yes it was a win now move and are hoping and thinking they will win, yet when some say they should be held to that standard, the breaks start pumping.

It makes sense to pay that for Alex Smith if you think you can have some decent playoff success over the next 5 years, even if you don't make the playoffs in year 1.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 10:22 AM

Then making the Alex SMith move makes no sense. If you don't expect to be a playoff contender, you don't make the move giving up what you did.

If you are rebuilding, you keep the picks and go from there. If you are in win now, you give up the picks for the guy.

Which they did, therefor, I don't understand why holding them to said standard is a big deal.

It seems some here are excited, saying yes it was a win now move and are hoping and thinking they will win, yet when some say they should be held to that standard, the breaks start pumping.

I think they have their eye on the playoffs, but you have to keep in mind what they are doing.
These guys had the task of cleaning up *****'s huge mess.
Hell half the team is brand new. S, nickel CB, #2 CB, ILB, DE, G, RT, #2 WR, TE, #2 TE.
It's gonna take more than 1 offseason to clean up this mess.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:23 AM

I'm not making a statement about right/wrong. My statement is about the way his actions, statement and level of "sold" remind me of mine back then.

That's what you're missing.

OK, well if you're not suggesting that he's wrong now like you were wrong then, then I guess I was mistaken.

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:23 AM

It makes sense to pay that for Alex Smith if you think you can have some decent playoff success over the next 5 years, even if you don't make the playoffs in year 1.

Thats fine, then we should go ahead and extend him if we expect him to be around that long.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:24 AM

I wonder if the Chiefs apologists would be asking "What do you expect from them?" if the Chiefs traded for a better QB.

Would you still be expecting a mediocre to bottom of the barrel season?

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 10:24 AM

My point was those teams gave up nothing for their dregs.

Agreed. Dorsey/Reid already called Alice their 2nd round pick this year so they are already short selling what they actually paid.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:24 AM

Because GMs of pro sports teams are altruists looking out to help opposing teams.

Don't you remember how Baltimore passed on signing Dumervil after Elvis said he wanted to play for the Miami Dolphins, his hometown team?

No?

No, because you are not stupid.

then what was your point?

Messier

05-13-2013, 10:24 AM

I dont think any of those teams are losing sleep over missing out on Alex Smith.

A stop gap is a stop gap is a stop gap.

The Chiefs just happened to pay for their stop gap like he's going to be around for the next decade because they are morons.

That's not true, but okay. Just lumping all the available QBs as stop gaps is a little lazy. Smith is coming out of recent success, and his team wanted him
The reason the other QBs came so cheap is that they were just as likely to be released as traded. I know you hate Smith, but if he's a stop gap, he's another level of stop gap than the likes of Palmer and Kolb.

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:25 AM

Agreed. Dorsey/Reid already called Alice their 2nd round pick this year so they are already short selling what they actually paid.

Don't forget Clark Hunt saying "We have our first-round quarterback, and he was actually a guy taken first overall."

o:-)

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:25 AM

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:25 AM

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:26 AM

That's not true, but okay. Just lumping all the available QBs as stop gaps is a little lazy. Smith is coming out of recent success, and his team wanted him
The reason the other QBs came so cheap is that they were just as likely to be released as traded. I know you hate Smith, but if he's a stop gap, he's another level of stop gap than the likes of Palmer and Kolb.

They wanted him so bad they benched him mid way through his best season and traded him in the following offseason...

Some peoples children.

You think the 49ers were going to pay Smith 7.5M to be a backup? GTFO. He was on his way to being cut as well. Shame the Chiefs were too scared that someone else might get a mediocre QB who hasn't done much better than Cassel for his career and overspent on yet another 49er washout.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 10:27 AM

Don't forget Clark Hunt saying "We have our first-round quarterback, and he was actually a guy taken first overall."

o:-)

He should be beaten with a rubber hose for that remark.

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 10:27 AM

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:27 AM

Thats fine, then we should go ahead and extend him if we expect him to be around that long.

If you extend him now and he has a career ending injury this season, you've thrown away a lot of money. There's no reason to extend him until the end of this year, unless you really think you can get a bargain by jumping the gun.

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:29 AM

I think they have their eye on the playoffs, but you have to keep in mind what they are doing.
These guys had the task of cleaning up *****'s huge mess.
Hell half the team is brand new. S, nickel CB, #2 CB, ILB, DE, G, RT, #2 WR, TE, #2 TE.
It's gonna take more than 1 offseason to clean up this mess.

Then they probably shouldn't have paid such a high price for a quarterback like Alex Smith, especially if he's just a two-year player.

If it's a big mess and they need a few offseasons to clean it up, spending the equivalent of a first-round pick on a stopgap QB makes no logical sense.

Spending that much to get Alex Smith - yes, the best available QB on the FA/trade market - only makes sense if you're trying to win now and think you can win big with him.

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:29 AM

If you extend him now and he has a career ending injury this season, you've thrown away a lot of money. There's no reason to extend him until the end of this year, unless you really think you can get a bargain by jumping the gun.

So if you extend him after this year, then he has a career ending injury, you're better off?

If you are that afraid of a guy having a career ending injury, you probably don't want to extend him.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:30 AM

Then they probably shouldn't have paid such a high price for a quarterback like Alex Smith, especially if he's just a two-year player.

If it's a big mess and they need a few offseasons to clean it up, spending the equivalent of a first-round pick on a stopgap QB makes no logical sense.

Spending that much to get Alex Smith - yes, the best available QB on the FA/trade market - only makes sense if you're trying to win now and win big.

Do you really think they see him as only a two-year player?

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:31 AM

Do you really think they see him as only a two-year player?

I can only hope.

The embarrassment of the trade is already gone. The embarrassment of tying the knot to this guy for the next 5 years can be prevented.

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:33 AM

Do you really think they see him as only a two-year player?

No, I don't.

But many in SUPPORT of the trade and price given cite that the team isn't "tied" to Alex Smith and can cut him lose, but that the deal was worth it because it gives them the best chance to win right now. While also saying that the Chiefs can always get their franchise guy later.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:34 AM

So if you extend him after this year, then he has a career ending injury, you're better off?

If you are that afraid of a guy having a career ending injury, you probably don't want to extend him.

You generally don't extend a guy with two years left on his contract. You extend him with one year (or less) left to keep him from getting to free agency. If free agency didn't exist, you'd wait all the way until the contract expired to negotiate a new one. The only reason to extend a contract before you need to, is if you think you can get the guy cheap now but that he's going to blow up and demand a huge contract later.

If you deviate from that norm and something goes wrong, you've made a bonehead blunder. If you don't deviate from that norm but something goes wrong, it's just bad luck.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 10:35 AM

then again why go for a guy who is on a 2 year deal? and is injury prone?

Best option out there this offseason and Reid has always liked his ability.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:35 AM

That's not true, but okay. Just lumping all the available QBs as stop gaps is a little lazy. Smith is coming out of recent success, and his team wanted him
The reason the other QBs came so cheap is that they were just as likely to be released as traded. I know you hate Smith, but if he's a stop gap, he's another level of stop gap than the likes of Palmer and Kolb.
his team wanted him so bad they drafted his replacement, let him become a free agent, courted peyton manning, resigned him after manning signed, then benched him halfway through the year, then traded him.

that sounds like the timeline of a team "wanting" somone

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:36 AM

Best option out there this offseason and Reid has always liked his ability.

best option to "win now" but its pretentious for us as fans to expect that. right?

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 10:37 AM

I think they are in win now mode and want to make the playoffs. Alex Smith was the best option right now. They had no choice. I know they are in win now mode but expecting them to automatically make the playoffs is a bit pretentious.
Pioli left this regime with holes to fill in a lot of spots.
Can't expect them to be this winning team in January in year 1.

"they had no choice". Yet, we can not expect a playoff appearance after being told, "all we need is a good game manager and competent coaching to be in it". You TF's are just ass-backward pathetic. Find a goddamned excuse and stick with it instead of trying to "nuance" your FAIL, please...
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RunKC

05-13-2013, 10:38 AM

And I like it that they aren't rewarding Alex Smith with an extention like Pioli did. They knew he was the best player available for the position, but if he doesn't back it up, he'll get benched.

The compensation sucks, but he was the best QB out there and we had no choice. SF had all the leverage.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 10:39 AM

No, I don't.

But many in SUPPORT of the trade and price given cite that the team isn't "tied" to Alex Smith and can cut him lose, but that the deal was worth it because it gives them the best chance to win right now. While also saying that the Chiefs can always get their franchise guy later.

I don't either, so at least we're on the same page there.

I don't really see that argument being made in that way much by the people who support (or at least recognize the reasonableness of) the trade. Instead, what I see is those people throwing a bone to the Alex critics by saying if he sucks as bad as the critics say he's going to suck, the Chiefs haven't tied themselves to him in the way Pioli tied himself to Cassel. In the unexpected event that he does suck that bad, the Chiefs can easily move on after this season or after a lame duck 2nd season.

FTR, I expect an extension for Alex Smith next offseason and I don't expect the Chiefs to draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd next year.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:40 AM

his team wanted him so bad they drafted his replacement, let him become a free agent, courted peyton manning, resigned him after manning signed, then benched him halfway through the year, then traded him.

that sounds like the timeline of a team "wanting" somone

Yet Harbaugh was sucking Alex off every chance he got to the media. Even brought Alex's wife flowers in the hospital. Harbaugh was the ultimate slick-oil salesman... He sucked Alex off to get him to stay in 2011... suckled some more to get him to start 2012 off at 6-2... then he pulled the rug out when he felt "his true golden boy" was ready. I get it. Kaepernick has crazy potential. Let us not pretend thought that Alex was discarded by Jim for some mediocre scrub though. Alex was in the top 5 in the NFL in efficiency when concussed... and then replaced.

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:40 AM

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 10:40 AM

And I like it that they aren't rewarding Alex Smith with an extention like ***** did. They knew he was the best player available for the position, but if he doesn't back it up, he'll get benched.

The compensation sucks, but he was the best QB out there and we had no choice. SF had all the leverage.

Sure we did.

If the rebuild is such a messy situation and is going to take more than one offseason, spend less on a lesser QB to be your stopgap guy.

That was the alternative choice.

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 10:40 AM

best option to "win now" but its pretentious for us as fans to expect that. right?

This. The True Fan has now lined up behind Reid and are mooing their way to the OAD feeding trough. "don't give me logic or sense, please". "Moooooo" etc.
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Alex Smith 4Ever

05-13-2013, 10:41 AM

They wanted him so bad they benched him mid way through his best season and traded him in the following offseason...

Some peoples children.

You think the 49ers were going to pay Smith 7.5M to be a backup? GTFO. He was on his way to being cut as well. Shame the Chiefs were too scared that someone else might get a mediocre QB who hasn't done much better than Cassel for his career and overspent on yet another 49er washout.

Smith wasn't going to be cut. Someone would have traded for him. And who should we have gone after instead? Second round pick Geno Smith?

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:41 AM

Yet Harbaugh was sucking Alex off every chance he got to the media. Even brought Alex's wife flowers in the hospital. Harbaugh was the ultimate slick-oil salesman... He sucked Alex off to get him to stay in 2011... suckled some more to get him to start 2012 off at 6-2... then he pulled the rug out when he felt "his true golden boy" was ready. I get it. Kaepernick has crazy potential. Let us not pretend thought that Alex was discarded by Jim for some mediocre scrub though. Alex was in the top 5 in the NFL in efficiency when concussed... and then replaced.

no one has said anywhere they discarded him for a scrub...

but they got as much or more back from him than they gave up for the future guy

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:43 AM

I forgot about the Manning courting. They didn't really want much to do with Alex Smith.

now the guys will say " but but it was manning"

but it wasnt just that. they then benched him for the unproven kapernick.

and i know he gotconcussed but he could have played again and kap's first two games were nothing special

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:44 AM

This. The True Fan has now lined up behind Reid and are mooing their way to the OAD feeding trough. "don't give me logic or sense, please". "Moooooo" etc.
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See, this is the problem. You guys have given your faith to prior regimes and in turn, ate shit for being wrong. So now, you absolutely refuse to let that happen again. It's call being butt-hurt... scarred for life... and scared. You are scared to ever give some hope and faith to your team. Scared, lil boys...standing in the corner and crying, "I loved her and she hurt me!!! I'll never love again!!!! Neva!!!!"

Your team would be real proud of ya! :thumb:

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:44 AM

Smith wasn't going to be cut. Someone would have traded for him. And who should we have gone after instead? Second round pick Geno Smith?

see this isnt a "we" thing.

but fuck yeah they should have gone after geno. where have you been/

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:45 AM

See, this is the problem. You guys have given your faith to prior regimes and in turn, ate shit for being wrong. So now, you absolutely refuse to let that happen again. It's call being butt-hurt... scarred for life... and scared. You are scared to ever give some hope and faith to your team. Scared, lil boys...standing in the corner and crying, "I loved her and she hurt me!!! I'll never love again!!!! Neva!!!!"

Your team would be real proud of ya! :thumb:

I'll give some hope and faith to the Chiefs when they start following the blueprint of building a successful NFL franchise and stop trying to reinvent the ****ing wheel.

The Hunts are hell bent on trying to prove that another teams trash can be the Chiefs treasure.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 10:45 AM

best option to "win now" but its pretentious for us as fans to expect that. right?

Pretty sure win now to them means making a strong push for the playoffs or making the playoffs (best case).

Pretentious thinking of win now is expecting them to automatically make the playoffs and start winning playoff games as a worst case scenario.

O.city

05-13-2013, 10:46 AM

They went with the win now approach, which is great. I'm ready for them to win now. But they did make the win now move, so I don't really see why there is a problem holding them to that standard.

People have been pissed on here saying people are too negative, yet now it seems we are getting that some are being too positive?

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:47 AM

I'll give some hope and faith to the Chiefs when they start following the blueprint of building a successful NFL franchise and stop trying to reinvent the ****ing wheel.

The Hunts are hell bent on trying to prove that another teams trash can be the Chiefs treasure.

Not how it works. That's just called hopping on the bandwagon.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:47 AM

Pretty sure win now to them means making a strong push for the playoffs or making the playoffs (best case).

Pretentious thinking of win now is expecting them to automatically make the playoffs and start winning playoff games as a worst case scenario.

and 8-8 is making a strong push...

guess what 8-8 isnt even playing "winning" football.

and if you trade 2 2nds for a win now qb you should be making noise come playoff time, no learning seasons...

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:48 AM

Not how it works. That's just called hopping on the bandwagon.

bullshit.

we have been here as fans for years, die hard.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:49 AM

jd1020

05-13-2013, 10:49 AM

Not how it works. That's just called hopping on the bandwagon.

You're a ****ing moron. Hopping on the bandwagon would be me becoming a Patriots, Packers, Saints, 49ers, Giants, Ravens, or Steelers fan in the middle of a SB run.

Just because I dont slurp the Chiefs splooge every time they release their load doesn't make me a bandwagon fan.

It means I want this team to stop being ****ing retarded.

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 10:49 AM

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:49 AM

bullshit.

we have been here as fans for years, die hard.

Die hard what???? Die hard haters and detractors? Stop the madness...

ChiefsCountry

05-13-2013, 10:52 AM

Die hard what???? Die hard haters and detractors? Stop the madness...

Shut the fuck up you worthless 49ers piece of shit troll. Nobody here gives a fuck about you. There are no bandwagon Chief fans you fucking piece of shit Alex Smith dick sucker.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:53 AM

Shut the **** up you worthless 49ers piece of shit troll. Nobody here gives a **** about you. There are no bandwagon Chief fans you ****ing piece of shit Alex Smith dick sucker.

u mad, bro?

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 10:54 AM

Die hard what???? Die hard haters and detractors? Stop the madness...

go fuck yourself

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 10:55 AM

go **** yourself

Truth hurts. Oh well.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 10:57 AM

I think Harbaugh was very comfortable with Smith and if he really had to stay with him it wouldnt have been a problem, but Is it really a stretch of the imagination to think an entire new regime wants to build their offense with what they have envisioned. Its not a detriment to Smith, its the nature of the NFL. Same thing is happening to Weeden and Gabert right now and they are just in year 2 and 3. Its on record him saying its the toughest decision hes ever had to make. Harbaugh has coached and been around some spectacular QBs. He saw Kapernick was ready and has his window to unleash him, made his decision and stuck with it. Smith did nothing wrong, only got concussed. There are many things Smith does better than Kapernick, but you cant teach what Kaper has. Harbaugh knew it.

RealSNR

05-13-2013, 10:57 AM

See, this is the problem. You guys have given your faith to prior regimes and in turn, ate shit for being wrong. So now, you absolutely refuse to let that happen again. It's call being butt-hurt... scarred for life... and scared. You are scared to ever give some hope and faith to your team. Scared, lil boys...standing in the corner and crying, "I loved her and she hurt me!!! I'll never love again!!!! Neva!!!!"

Your team would be real proud of ya! :thumb:

What's that definition of insanity again?

The only irrational fucksticks around here are people like you who think we should go into full homer mode like a bunch of goddamn inbred Donk fans.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 11:06 AM

What's that definition of insanity again?

The only irrational ****sticks around here are people like you who think we should go into full homer mode like a bunch of goddamn inbred Donk fans.

Nah. I think there's a middle ground to be had. There are a handful of homers and Chicken Littles for every fanbase... but there are mostly people that settle in the middle. Unfortunately, those people tend to stay quiet or leave the extremists behind... as they don't wish to be bothered with idiocy.

I'm not at all saying KC is brilliant in every way and are immediately SB bound.

What I am saying is that they have done enough that fans should probably not go to extreme positives or negatives.

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 11:13 AM

Nah. I think there's a middle ground to be had. There are a handful of homers and Chicken Littles for every fanbase... but there are mostly people that settle in the middle. Unfortunately, those people tend to stay quiet or leave the extremists behind... as they don't wish to be bothered with idiocy.

I'm not at all saying KC is brilliant in every way and are immediately SB bound.

What I am saying is that they have done enough that fans should probably not go to extreme positives or negatives.

No one cares what you think we should do. Go rape yourself with a rusty mace.
Posted via Mobile Device

duncan_idaho

05-13-2013, 11:14 AM

See, this is the problem. You guys have given your faith to prior regimes and in turn, ate shit for being wrong. So now, you absolutely refuse to let that happen again. It's call being butt-hurt... scarred for life... and scared. You are scared to ever give some hope and faith to your team. Scared, lil boys...standing in the corner and crying, "I loved her and she hurt me!!! I'll never love again!!!! Neva!!!!"

Your team would be real proud of ya! :thumb:

Yes, after seeing the same exact approach fail for 30 years, the Chiefs fanbase should just sigh and hope it will work this time.

We have seen this chorus and verse, and it has ended in varying degrees of failure time and again. I will never apologize for asking the team to SHOW me it will work this time.

Fool me once, fool me 5x)...

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 11:15 AM

Smith wasn't going to be cut. Someone would have traded for him. And who should we have gone after instead? Second round pick Geno Smith?

Hell the fuck yes Geno Smith at least he has potential for something better than we have had over the last 40 years.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 11:30 AM

and 8-8 is making a strong push...

guess what 8-8 isnt even playing "winning" football.

and if you trade 2 2nds for a win now qb you should be making noise come playoff time, no learning seasons...

You couldn't be more wrong.

Alex Smith is learning a new system with a new team. And 8-8 is a good bar to put this compensation at for the first year.

Matt Schaub was traded for the same price and he was only 7-9 his first year in Houston.

Jay Cutler was traded for more and he was only 8-8 in his first year.

Hell Trent Green was traded for more compensation too and we finished 6-10 the first year with him.

It's not just about the QB. It's a team sport, and right now our team barely knows each other at practice because almost half of them are brand new.

It's amazing that people think that a 2-14 team with the 1st pick in the draft is supposed to make the playoffs and make noise in January the next year.
Pretty sure a team has never done that before and for good reason.

King_Chief_Fan

05-13-2013, 11:30 AM

Hell the **** yes Geno Smith at least he has potential for something better than we have had over the last 40 years.

are you saying that you would have picked at 1.1 Geno Smith?

O.city

05-13-2013, 11:31 AM

You couldn't be more wrong.

Alex Smith is learning a new system with a new team. And 8-8 is a good bar to put this compensation at for the first year.

Matt Schaub was traded for the same price and he was only 7-9 his first year in Houston.

Jay Cutler was traded for more and he was only 8-8 in his first year.

Hell Trent Green was traded for more compensation too and we finished 6-10 the first year with him.

It's not just about the QB. It's a team sport, and right now our team barely knows each other at practice because almost half of them are brand new.

It's amazing that people think that a 2-14 team with the 1st pick in the draft is supposed to make the playoffs and make noise in January the next year.
Pretty sure a team has never done that before and for good reason.

All those other teams made those moves, because they thought they were close and said player was the one to put them over the edge.

A 2-14 team with the first pick in the draft probably shouldn't have made said move if they didn't think they were closer.

King_Chief_Fan

05-13-2013, 11:32 AM

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:36 AM

You couldn't be more wrong.

Alex Smith is learning a new system with a new team. And 8-8 is a good bar to put this compensation at for the first year.

Matt Schaub was traded for the same price and he was only 7-9 his first year in Houston.

Jay Cutler was traded for more and he was only 8-8 in his first year.

Hell Trent Green was traded for more compensation too and we finished 6-10 the first year with him.

It's not just about the QB. It's a team sport, and right now our team barely knows each other at practice because almost half of them are brand new.

It's amazing that people think that a 2-14 team with the 1st pick in the draft is supposed to make the playoffs and make noise in January the next year.
Pretty sure a team has never done that before and for good reason. what did Indy do last fucking year?
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:37 AM

Better than 8-8 that's for fucking sure
Posted via Mobile Device

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 11:38 AM

are you saying that you would have picked at 1.1 Geno Smith?

Yes YES and YES I would have picked Geno Smith 1.1

I'd also keep scouting the next years draft class for another potential starting quarterback and maybe draft him for competition and create trade value. We have neglected drafting a top prospect for so many years it wouldn't hurt to go back to back with drafting top prospects.

Yes I think Geno Smith has potential to be really good so he would have been worth the pick. At the least not trade for Alex Smith and take him with our second round pick. Could have got him then.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 11:38 AM

All those other teams made those moves, because they thought they were close and said player was the one to put them over the edge.

A 2-14 team with the first pick in the draft probably shouldn't have made said move if they didn't think they were closer.

Making a strong push for the playoffs next year would be a success IMO.

Year 2 is when they really need to make the playoffs and win at least 1 playoff game.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 11:38 AM

LMAO @ Lil Mac trying to force feed Chiefs fans a steaming pile of 49er shit and having it spit back in his face.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:38 AM

So w are going to go through ANOTHER "learning year" with our 29 year old qb
Posted via Mobile Device

keg in kc

05-13-2013, 11:39 AM

Making excuses for Alex Smith in May. Glad to see we have such high expectations.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:39 AM

what did Indy do last ****ing year?
Posted via Mobile Device

Lost their only January game.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:40 AM

Making a strong push for the playoffs next year would be a success IMO.

Year 2 is when they really need to make the playoffs and win at least 1 playoff game.
Again. 8-8 isn't making a "strong push" for the playoffs. Hell out isn't even winning football.

And after the learning year we only have one more year of Smith locked up... Then what?
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:40 AM

Lost their only January game.

Did they go 8-8?
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:41 AM

Again. 8-8 isn't making a "strong push" for the playoffs. Hell out isn't even winning football.

And after the learning year we only have one more year of Smith locked up... Then what?
Posted via Mobile Device

Then you extend him.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:41 AM

Did they go 8-8?
Posted via Mobile Device

No, why do you ask?

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:41 AM

Then you extend him.

What if he declines?
Posted via Mobile Device

RunKC

05-13-2013, 11:42 AM

what did Indy do last ****ing year?
Posted via Mobile Device

When did Indy make noise in the playoffs? They didn't. They were one-and-done.

What they did last year was very rare. Pretty sure it's never happened before.

Saying that this team has to make the playoffs or it's a failure of a season is ridiculous.

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 11:42 AM

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:42 AM

What if he declines?
Posted via Mobile Device

When?

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:43 AM

You couldn't be more wrong.

Alex Smith is learning a new system with a new team. And 8-8 is a good bar to put this compensation at for the first year.

Matt Schaub was traded for the same price and he was only 7-9 his first year in Houston.

Jay Cutler was traded for more and he was only 8-8 in his first year.

Hell Trent Green was traded for more compensation too and we finished 6-10 the first year with him.

It's not just about the QB. It's a team sport, and right now our team barely knows each other at practice because almost half of them are brand new.

It's amazing that people think that a 2-14 team with the 1st pick in the draft is supposed to make the playoffs and make noise in January the next year.
Pretty sure a team has never done that before and for good reason.

What the hell did Indy just do with Andrew Luck?

As I just mentioned, they lost the only game they played in January.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 11:43 AM

You couldn't be more wrong.

Alex Smith is learning a new system with a new team. And 8-8 is a good bar to put this compensation at for the first year.

Matt Schaub was traded for the same price and he was only 7-9 his first year in Houston.

Jay Cutler was traded for more and he was only 8-8 in his first year.

Hell Trent Green was traded for more compensation too and we finished 6-10 the first year with him.

It's not just about the QB. It's a team sport, and right now our team barely knows each other at practice because almost half of them are brand new.

It's amazing that people think that a 2-14 team with the 1st pick in the draft is supposed to make the playoffs and make noise in January the next year.
Pretty sure a team has never done that before and for good reason.

What the hell did Indy just do with Andrew Luck?

They didn't do a damn thing in January last year. They were one-and-done.

That's not making noise in January folks.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:43 AM

No, why do you ask?

Because people are acting like 8-8 should be the goal because going from 2-14 to better than 8-8 is unheard of...

I know he put a qualifier in there. You guys aren't that slick patty
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:45 AM

[QUOTE=KC Tattoo;9678715]

They didn't do a damn thing in January last year. They were one-and-done.

That's not making noise in January folks. yeah I caught your qualifier.

They were better than 8-8.

They played winning football and had a chance in the playoffs.

How many 8-8 teams have ever won a playoff game?
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:46 AM

When?

Dude I'm not talking in circles with you.

It's obviously what was said.
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:48 AM

Oh and who beat them in the playoffs?

The champs
Posted via Mobile Device

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 11:49 AM

That's funny shit. Using "January" instead of playoffs to try to make point. I've seen it all now LMAO

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 11:50 AM

When is the last time the team with the first pick in the draft returned 6 pro bowlers?

So we shouldn't expect the same results as a team with a rookie QB and less talent on the roster?

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 11:51 AM

[QUOTE=KC Tattoo;9678715]

They didn't do a damn thing in January last year. They were one-and-done.

That's not making noise in January folks.

I would be happy to go to the playoffs with a rooky quarterback but to go back to the playoffs with a retread vet and lose is fucking what we have been doing and we never get anywhere for it the following seasons. fucking geeze people.

A rooky quarterback you can bring in guys to upgrade the team for years to come and give yourself 10+ years of Super Bowl window of opportunity. With retreads you are limited and have less than 5 years if they don't break apart. The best chance we had was with Trent Green and he gave us 5 years. This franchise averages quarterbacks 2.5 years for the last 30 years that is not building for a Championship. It's the same with Alex Smith he will be lucky to last 3 years as a Chief that doesn't get blasted out of the starting line up with injury. Assuming he stays healthy he is still just a mediocre quarterback that relies heavy on the ground game to set up play action.

Messier

05-13-2013, 11:55 AM

Because people are acting like 8-8 should be the goal because going from 2-14 to better than 8-8 is unheard of...

I know he put a qualifier in there. You guys aren't that slick patty
Posted via Mobile Device

Are there? Because this all started when some here turned the news that the 3rd becomes a 2nd if the Chiefs go 8-8, into, the Chiefs are satisfied with 8-8, which if a wildly inaccurate view. The "realistic" fans like to think they have the correct stance on every Chiefs issue, but they fly off the handle with some theories. Thinking Clark Hunt has some sort of mandate to not draft a QB in the first, and thinking the "true" fans are satisfied with mediocrity are silly notions.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:58 AM

Are there? Because this all started when some here turned the news that the 3rd becomes a 2nd if the Chiefs go 8-8, into, the Chiefs are satisfied with 8-8, which if a wildly inaccurate view. The "realistic" fans like to think they have the correct stance on every Chiefs issue, but they fly off the handle with some theories. Thinking Clark Hunt has some sort of mandate to not draft a QB in the first, and thinking the "true" fans are satisfied with mediocrity are silly notions.
Not sure of the question. Clarify please.
Posted via Mobile Device

Messier

05-13-2013, 11:59 AM

They wanted him so bad they benched him mid way through his best season and traded him in the following offseason...

Some peoples children.

You think the 49ers were going to pay Smith 7.5M to be a backup? GTFO. He was on his way to being cut as well. Shame the Chiefs were too scared that someone else might get a mediocre QB who hasn't done much better than Cassel for his career and overspent on yet another 49er washout.

This is awash in your own opinion of Smith and not what people have done or said.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 11:59 AM

Because people are acting like 8-8 should be the goal because going from 2-14 to better than 8-8 is unheard of...

I know he put a qualifier in there. You guys aren't that slick patty
Posted via Mobile Device

No, people don't act like that. People act like that is a reasonable first year accomplishment even if the goal is loftier.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 11:59 AM

If you are asking if there are people saying going 8-8 is acceptable because a team can't do better coming off a2-14 season then I'm going to say yes there are.

Read through the thread.
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:01 PM

Dude I'm not talking in circles with you.

It's obviously what was said.
Posted via Mobile Device

OK, I don't know how to answer your question then. If he declines before you've extended him, then don't extend him. If he declines 8 years down the road after winning a few Super Bowls for you, put him in the ring of honor.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:01 PM

No, people don't act like that. People act like that is a reasonable first year accomplishment even if the goal is loftier.

Bullshit.

People have said they would be ok with 8-8 this year, because our 29 year old qb the team brought in to win now with needs a learning season.
Posted via Mobile Device

Messier

05-13-2013, 12:02 PM

Not sure of the question. Clarify please.
Posted via Mobile Device

Sorry. Should have said, are They. As in are people satisfied with 8-8? That wasn't where this all started.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:03 PM

OK, I don't know how to answer your question then. If he declines before you've extended him, then don't extend him. If he declines 8 years down the road after winning a few Super Bowls for you, put him in the ring of honor. no one is taking any 8 years down the road.

You made that up.

the conversation with me was focused on the fact he's under contract for two years.

Read back through the posts, get up to speed, then get back to me
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:03 PM

When is the last time the team with the first pick in the draft returned 6 pro bowlers?

So we shouldn't expect the same results as a team with a rookie QB and less talent on the roster?

Given your poor opinion of Alex Smith, you probably should expect the Chiefs to be horrible.

Given the unprecedented 6 pro bowlers, there's plenty of reason to be optimistic, but the team still lost 14 games so it would be ridiculous to think they're poised for immediate playoff success.

RunKC

05-13-2013, 12:04 PM

[QUOTE=RunKC;9678721] yeah I caught your qualifier.

They were better than 8-8.

They played winning football and had a chance in the playoffs.

How many 8-8 teams have ever won a playoff game?
Posted via Mobile Device

I don't understand why you're talking like we absolutely have to win a playoff game this year.

You're taking the ceiling of next years expectations and trying to make it the floor.

Sweet Daddy Hate

05-13-2013, 12:04 PM

Ultimately, I lose no sleep whatsoever. Bray is in the house and barring complete incompetence on Reid and Co.'s part, will be ready for 2015 or sooner. And, seeing as how 7-9 with a wildcard asswhipping is the undisputed ceiling for a 2-14 team in a transition year...I worry not one iota about that second round pick.
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:04 PM

Sorry. Should have said, are They. As in are people satisfied with 8-8? That wasn't where this all started.
Yes people have cautioned that we are silly for expecting more. Pretentious was the word.

If they think that shouldn't we be led to believe they are ok with that?
Posted via Mobile Device

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 12:04 PM

Bullshit.

People have said they would be ok with 8-8 this year, because our 29 year old qb the team brought in to win now with needs a learning season.
Posted via Mobile Device

This is the thing right here. If he is suppose to be better than Matty Cassel and we went to the playoffs in 2010 and this is basically the same nucleus of a team with upgraded O-line then we have no excuse not to win a fucking playoff game this year let alone get there.

Any thing less is bull shit for a retread quarterback.

ChiefsCountry

05-13-2013, 12:04 PM

You make a trade giving up two second round picks for a 28 year old quarterback, you better be 8-8 or better.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:07 PM

Bullshit.

People have said they would be ok with 8-8 this year, because our 29 year old qb the team brought in to win now with needs a learning season.
Posted via Mobile Device

That's not the same thing. Why did you change the words you're using?

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:08 PM

no one is taking any 8 years down the road.

You made that up.

the conversation with me was focused on the fact he's under contract for two years.

Read back through the posts, get up to speed, then get back to me
Posted via Mobile Device

I'll wait until you clarify when Alex Smith declines in your hypothetical. That will be the easiest way to focus this.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:12 PM

[QUOTE=JASONSAUTO;9678728]

I don't understand why you're talking like we absolutely have to win a playoff game this year.

You're taking the ceiling of next years expectations and trying to make it the floor.
We don't absolutely have to win a playoff game.

We should definitely play winning football, and 8-8 is by no definition winning football, and make the playoffs and have a chance to beat anyone in them.
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:13 PM

We don't absolutely have to win a playoff game.

We should definitely play winning football, and 8-8 is by no definition winning football, and make the playoffs and have a chance to beat anyone in them.
Posted via Mobile Device

You seem to have a lot of confidence in Alex Smith. I never would have guessed it.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:15 PM

I'll wait until you clarify when Alex Smith declines in your hypothetical. That will be the easiest way to focus this.

Wtf you talking about? I never brought up a decline?

He said make a serious push for the playoffs, or 8-8 same thing, then winning playoff games the next year.

I asked what do we do then with our qb whose contract is up.

You said extend him.

I said what if he declines.

You asked when?

you made no sense
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:16 PM

You seem to have a lot of confidence in Alex Smith. I never would have guessed it.

The team traded for him.

That is what I expect out of a vet qb that was traded for 2 2nds.

Never said Smith would get us there.

But nice try to spin my words buddy
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:21 PM

Wtf you talking about? I never brought up a decline?

He said make a serious push for the playoffs, or 8-8 same thing, then winning playoff games the next year.

I asked what do we do then with our qb whose contract is up.

You said extend him.

I said what if he declines.

You asked when?

you made no sense
Posted via Mobile Device

As you admit, you did ask what happens if he declines. I took it to mean what if his skills decline. I'm guessing now that you mean what if he refuses to sign a new contract. This could have easily been cleared up 20 or 30 posts ago if you had addressed my question directly instead of bailing on it and going with snark instead.

If he refuses to sign an extension, you look for a different option (either Bray if he's progressed, or some other guy they've picked up, or a guy in the draft, or another free agent/trade). I didn't understand what you meant because it's such a no brainer.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:22 PM

The team traded for him.

That is what I expect out of a vet qb that was traded for 2 2nds.

Never said Smith would get us there.

But nice try to spin my words buddy
Posted via Mobile Device

In other words, your job now is to elevate the "success" bar as high as you possibly can so you can declare failure and justify your current position. I understand you, I just think it's lame.

Lex Luthor

05-13-2013, 12:23 PM

Just call it what it is. It's a 1st round pick. By calling them mulitple 2nds it seems to downgrade how much they truely invested in Alice.

Agreed. Dorsey/Reid already called Alice their 2nd round pick this year so they are already short selling what they actually paid.
You'd really be better off if you would stop claiming that the Chiefs invested a first round pick on Alex Smith. They didn't. And you know it.

Lying about it to strengthen your argument actually weakens your argument because you lose credibility.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:24 PM

As you admit, you did ask what happens if he declines. I took it to mean what if his skills decline. I'm guessing now that you mean what if he refuses to sign a new contract. This could have easily been cleared up 20 or 30 posts ago if you had addressed my question directly instead of bailing on it and going with snark instead.

If he refuses to sign an extension, you look for a different option (either Bray if he's progressed, or some other guy they've picked up, or a guy in the draft, or another free agent/trade). I didn't understand what you meant because it's such a no brainer. dude he isn't going to fucking decline in ability the year he starts winning us playoff games...

Its a no brainer to trade 2 2nd round picks and let the guy walk after two years and go on to the next option?

Especially after having a "learning year" burnt and finally starting to win, in this hypothetical of run's.

This is why its stupid to trade for a retread vet.
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:29 PM

In other words, your job now is to elevate the "success" bar as high as you possibly can so you can declare failure and justify your current position. I understand you, I just think it's lame.
I didn't ask to go undefeated... I didn't say we had to win a playoff game...

I could have set the bar higher.

Those should be realistic goals of a team who traded 2 2nds for an eight year vet qb, and same team that has six current pro bowlers.

We have a top ten LT and a number one drafted Rt, a great rb, no one wr,

Why shouldn't we be expecting to get to the playoffs and actually have a shot there?
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:29 PM

dude he isn't going to ****ing decline in ability the year he starts winning us playoff games...

Its a no brainer to trade 2 2nd round picks and let the guy walk after two years and go on to the next option?

Especially after having a "learning year" burnt and finally starting to win, in this hypothetical of run's.

This is why its stupid to trade for a retread vet.
Posted via Mobile Device

The chances of him walking after two years and leaving the Chiefs in the lurch are about zero, IMO. He'll be extended before that if he's panning out.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:30 PM

You'd really be better off if you would stop claiming that the Chiefs invested a first round pick on Alex Smith. They didn't. And you know it.

Lying about it to strengthen your argument actually weakens your argument because you lose credibility. by draft value 2 2nds equals a first.

I wouldn't say it the way he did but I get where they can look at the compensation in that light
Posted via Mobile Device

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:31 PM

I didn't ask to go undefeated... I didn't say we had to win a playoff game...

I could have set the bar higher.

Those should be realistic goals of a team who traded 2 2nds for an eight year vet qb, and same team that has six current pro bowlers.

We have a top ten LT and a number one drafted Rt, a great rb, no one wr,

Why shouldn't we be expecting to get to the playoffs and actually have a shot there?
Posted via Mobile Device

Pushing hard for the playoffs is a reasonable goal and that's what RunKC said initially. Making the playoffs and having a shot there isn't a bad goal, but falling just short in the first year when everyone is trying to get on the same page under a new system isn't failure.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:32 PM

The chances of him walking after two years and leaving the Chiefs in the lurch are about zero, IMO. He'll be extended before that if he's panning out.

Dude he just went to free agency last year, you can assume he will want to extend, but its just that...
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:32 PM

Pushing hard for the playoffs is a reasonable goal and that's what RunKC said initially. Making the playoffs and having a shot there isn't a bad goal, but falling just short in the first year when everyone is trying to get on the same page under a new system isn't failure.
And I don't give a fuck what either of you say 8-8 isn't making a serious push for the playoffs.

Both of your words
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:34 PM

Oh and when would the extension take place?

After the "learning year"?

During the winning playoff run?
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:35 PM

And falling short of a goal is actually a failure
Posted via Mobile Device

Messier

05-13-2013, 12:36 PM

Yes people have cautioned that we are silly for expecting more. Pretentious was the word.

If they think that shouldn't we be led to believe they are ok with that?
Posted via Mobile Device

Who has? Because they're wrong if they are.

But this goes with some of the real fan myths. Hunt declared, no first round QBs, and fans that have optimism, are satisfied with mediocrity.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 12:40 PM

You'd really be better off if you would stop claiming that the Chiefs invested a first round pick on Alex Smith. They didn't. And you know it.

Lying about it to strengthen your argument actually weakens your argument because you lose credibility.

They traded what will be the equivalent of a 1st round pick. You can call 2 + 2 (2 + 2), but I'll go ahead and just call it 4.

Lex Luthor

05-13-2013, 12:41 PM

by draft value 2 2nds equals a first.

I wouldn't say it the way he did but I get where they can look at the compensation in that light
Posted via Mobile Device
The #1 overall pick is worth 3000 points on the draft value chart.

The top pick in the second round is worth 580 points. If the Chiefs go 8-8 next year, their second round pick will be worth around 410 points.

What does this mean? It means the Chiefs first round draft choice was worth three times as much as the two second rounders they gave up for Alex Smith. They did NOT trade the equivalent of their first round draft choice for Alex Smith. If the Chiefs had been drafting #16 overall, then the argument would be valid based upon draft value.

Lex Luthor

05-13-2013, 12:42 PM

It's called perspective. They traded what will be the equivalent of a 1st round pick. You can call 2 + 2 (2 + 2), but I'll go ahead and just call it 4.

See post #1655. By your math, 580 + 410 = 3000.

If you want to say that the Chiefs traded the equivalent of the Steeler's first round pick for Alex Smith, then you would at least be mathematically accurate.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:45 PM

And I don't give a **** what either of you say 8-8 isn't making a serious push for the playoffs.

Both of your words
Posted via Mobile Device

Like BigCatDaddy said, sometimes it is and sometimes it isn't, whether you agree or not.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 12:46 PM

Oh and when would the extension take place?

After the "learning year"?

During the winning playoff run?
Posted via Mobile Device

It's going to happen after the first year unless Smith falls flat on his face.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:49 PM

The #1 overall pick is worth 3000 points on the draft value chart.

The top pick in the second round is worth 580 points. If the Chiefs go 8-8 next year, their second round pick will be worth around 410 points.

What does this mean? It means the Chiefs first round draft choice was worth three times as much as the two second rounders they gave up for Alex Smith. They did NOT trade the equivalent of their first round draft choice for Alex Smith. If the Chiefs had been drafting #16 overall, then the argument would be valid based upon draft value.
you didn't read very well.

He said the chiefs, in the post you quoted, traded A first round pick.

Not puts this year
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:49 PM

Ours not puts, won't let me edit it
Posted via Mobile Device

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 12:50 PM

The #1 overall pick is worth 3000 points on the draft value chart.

The top pick in the second round is worth 580 points. If the Chiefs go 8-8 next year, their second round pick will be worth around 410 points.

What does this mean? It means the Chiefs first round draft choice was worth three times as much as the two second rounders they gave up for Alex Smith. They did NOT trade the equivalent of their first round draft choice for Alex Smith. If the Chiefs had been drafting #16 overall, then the argument would be valid based upon draft value.

This where reading comprehension can come into play. I sad they gave up "A" 1st round pick, not "their" first round pick. As you pointed out the picks they gave up is "1st round value" and would likely 5-10 teams would have taken that trade off this year to get up into the 1st round. They gave up what amounts to a 1st round pick. Thanks for backing me up on that one.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:51 PM

It's going to happen after the first year unless Smith falls flat on his face.

After a non winning "learning year"?

What is a non winning learning year going to tell us?
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:51 PM

Who has? Because they're wrong if they are.

But this goes with some of the real fan myths. Hunt declared, no first round QBs, and fans that have optimism, are satisfied with mediocrity. look around
Posted via Mobile Device

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 12:52 PM

They wont extend Smith until they have to, good or bad play. Its just NFL business, especially with the cap going up again. Why would they extend him before they need to, it just takes away money to give to other areas of team need. Once they work the logistics they will make their decision. One thing hasnt been said alot, even though they paid in draft picks the Chiefs are only giving him around 8mil. That is chump change for a starting QB in the League.

ChiefsCountry

05-13-2013, 12:52 PM

Lex Luthor

05-13-2013, 12:56 PM

you didn't read very well.

He said the chiefs, in the post you quoted, traded A first round pick.

Not puts this year
Posted via Mobile Device

This where reading comprehension can come into play. I sad they gave up "A" 1st round pick, not "their" first round pick. As you pointed out the picks they gave up is "1st round value" and would likely 5-10 teams would have taken that trade off this year to get up into the 1st round. They gave up what amounts to a 1st round pick.
Thanks guys. However, I fully understand the difference between "a first round pick" and "the Chiefs first round pick". The Chiefs didn't have a hypothetical first round pick this year. They had the #1 overall pick.

If you want to continue to misrepresent the trade, then by all means feel free to do so.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:57 PM

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 12:58 PM

Thanks guys. However, I fully understand the difference between "a first round pick" and "the Chiefs first round pick".

If you want to continue to misrepresent the trade, then by all means feel free to do so.
Only one thing was misrepresented here.the chiefs gave the equivalent of a first round pick up for Smith.

Its true even by your math
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 01:01 PM

We couldn't give up the number one and take a player at that spot, which we did. I think most people understand what he means when he says that.

The people that try to twist it are the ones who have nothing else
Posted via Mobile Device

Messier

05-13-2013, 01:03 PM

look around
Posted via Mobile Device

I see people saying 8-8 would be improvement, I don't see any, 8-8 is mission accomplished for Reid.

Messier

05-13-2013, 01:05 PM

This fan base amazes me. You trade for a 28 year old QB because you can win now with him. Then the expectations change when quarterback gets here and is treated like a rookie. Unbelievable. We better win some ****ing football games this year if you trade for a veteran quarterback in his prime. No time for rebuilding horseshit with a vet quarterback.

I took that as the obvious goal when we went Smith. I don't think this is any rebuilding year.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 01:13 PM

Like BigCatDaddy said, sometimes it is and sometimes it isn't, whether you agree or not.
I disagree with his assessment.

8-5 and ending up 8-8 is not making a serious push for the playoffs...

Its stepping on your dick in crunch time.

Who has done that before?

What was it? 3-13 on third down conversions?
Posted via Mobile Device

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 01:14 PM

And falling short of a goal is actually a failure
Posted via Mobile Device

Pffft..

Just wait for the excuses if we go 6-10 or 7-9.

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 01:14 PM

I see people saying 8-8 would be improvement, I don't see any, 8-8 is mission accomplished for Reid.

I never said that.
Posted via Mobile Device

SAUTO

05-13-2013, 01:14 PM

Pffft..

Just wait for the excuses if we go 6-10 or 7-9.
They are already being typed
Posted via Mobile Device

RunKC

05-13-2013, 01:44 PM

I think we're gonna be 9-7, but w our schedule, I wouldn't be surprised if we made the playoffs.

Ming the Merciless

05-13-2013, 01:46 PM

I think we're gonna be 9-7, but w our schedule, I wouldn't be surprised if we made the playoffs.

You wouldn't?

I would.....considering the odds are very very slim...

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7020606464/hC4C7C71C/

007

05-13-2013, 01:49 PM

http://i28.tinypic.com/2553ya0.jpg

patteeu

05-13-2013, 02:21 PM

After a non winning "learning year"?

What is a non winning learning year going to tell us?
Posted via Mobile Device

It's going to tell Andy Reid whether he thinks Alex Smith is his multi-year answer or whether he needs to look around for an alternative. The final record isn't the measure of merit for that determination.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 02:24 PM

This fan base amazes me. You trade for a 28 year old QB because you can win now with him. Then the expectations change when quarterback gets here and is treated like a rookie. Unbelievable. We better win some ****ing football games this year if you trade for a veteran quarterback in his prime. No time for rebuilding horseshit with a vet quarterback.

We've got an entire team that knows how to lose but may not know how to win yet. It's not like this team was a plug and play QB away last year. There's a wide range of possible outcomes for this coming season that have little or nothing to do with how well Alex Smith plays.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 02:24 PM

It's going to tell Andy Reid whether he thinks Alex Smith is his multi-year answer or whether he needs to look around for an alternative. The final record isn't the measure of merit for that determination.

Oh cool.

So here we are... sitting around waiting to see if Alex Smith will make it in his 9th season and if he doesn't we're hoping that a UDFA QB gets his head out of his ass and becomes the next Kurt Warner. And if said scenario falls apart in midair we'll once again be looking for the next reject for the 2015 season and some 3rd day developmental QB.

FUCK YA!

Which backups contracts are ending after the 2014 season? Who's going to be our next QB?

Rasputin

05-13-2013, 02:32 PM

Pffft..

Just wait for the excuses if we go 6-10 or 7-9.

They are already being typed
Posted via Mobile Device

We've got an entire team that knows how to lose but may not know how to win yet. It's not like this team was a plug and play QB away last year. There's a wide range of possible outcomes for this coming season that have little or nothing to do with how well Alex Smith plays.

Wow your right JASONSAUTO the quarterback doesn't even have to play any good to get a pass for being our quarterback. The quarterback has little to do with the outcomes of games. What am I freaking out for?

patteeu

05-13-2013, 02:33 PM

Oh cool.

So here we are... sitting around waiting to see if Alex Smith will make it in his 9th season and if he doesn't we're hoping that a UDFA QB gets his head out of his ass and becomes the next Kurt Warner. And if said scenario falls apart in midair we'll once again be looking for the next reject for the 2015 season and some 3rd day developmental QB.

**** YA!

Which backups contracts are ending after the 2014 season? Who's going to be our next QB?

I wouldn't worry too much about that. Alex Smith will be here for a while.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 02:35 PM

I wouldn't worry too much about that. Alex Smith will be here for a while.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/250x250/36724984.jpg

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 02:49 PM

Thanks guys. However, I fully understand the difference between "a first round pick" and "the Chiefs first round pick". The Chiefs didn't have a hypothetical first round pick this year. They had the #1 overall pick.

If you want to continue to misrepresent the trade, then by all means feel free to do so.

So you do understand they gave up what would essentially be around the 25th pick in the draft this year, yes?

Dorsey loves dumbasses like you that fall for hit "Smith was our 2nd round pick"shit.

Now just change your user name to "Dumbass", post a pictured of yourself as your avi, and walk away.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 03:06 PM

I wouldn't worry too much about that. Alex Smith will be here for a while.

Yep. I am glad some of us will be enjoying the Chiefs season! :thumb:

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 03:16 PM

Yep. I am glad some of us will be enjoying the Chiefs season! :thumb:

Yep, me to. Either the Chiefs play great or Alice falls flat on his glass ass. Either will be a joy to watch so it's a win win.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 03:24 PM

Yep, me to. Either the Chiefs play great or Alice falls flat on his glass ass. Either will be a joy to watch so it's a win win.

I really dont get the whole "glass' or "injury prone" bit. His shoulder injury is going on 5 years now. That is a life time in the NFL. The shoulder is long behind him. What can you do about concussions in todays NFL? That the game we live in today. Your gonna sit, He was cleared to play the week after, Harbaugh had his window and went with it. To say he is injury prone is kinda outawhack.

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 03:29 PM

OnTheWarpath15

05-13-2013, 03:29 PM

I really dont get the whole "glass' or "injury prone" bit. His shoulder injury is going on 5 years now. That is a life time in the NFL. The shoulder is long behind him. What can you do about concussions in todays NFL? That the game we live in today. Your gonna sit, He was cleared to play the week after, Harbaugh had his window and went with it. To say he is injury prone is kinda outawhack.

To say he's injury prone is spot-fucking on.

80 games played in 7 seasons. 11.4 per year.

Last I checked, the NFL plays 16 games per season.

So Alex Smith is missing over 4 games PER SEASON.

Only on CP can a guy miss 25% of his games and people say that the injury prone label is "kinda outawhack".

Or would you rather point out that he's missed games because he's been benched for scrubs like Shaun Hill?

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 03:33 PM

yea i will point that out, injured injured is the point not benched

jd1020

05-13-2013, 03:35 PM

yea i will point that out, injured injured is the point not benched

So he's either been injured or not good enough to start.

Sounds like a sound 2 2nd round pick investment.

MagicHef

05-13-2013, 03:37 PM

I did a linear regression between pass attempts per game and various stats per attempt for Alex. Someone mentioned that Reid typically called 35 passes per game, so I based it on that number.

If you base it on his entire career, you could expect:

3661 yards, 25 TDs, 10 INTs, 1 Fumble, and 24 Sacks.

I think Chiefs fans would be very happy with that. However, it is kind of skewed by a horrible rookie season with very few attempts. If you limit it to the last 4 seasons to cover his career after his injury, you get:

3498 yards, 22 TDs, 17 INTs, 5 Fumbles, and 32 Sacks.

That seems pretty realistic.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 03:39 PM

Just on the flip side, He is also one the only QBs in the History of the NFL to start and play every single snap of a an entire season. Tom Brady had a fluke knee injury, im sure youve seen the hit. So did Smith, Take a look at Rocky Bernard's hit on Smith. Smith was bench a few times just because like many coaches they want to make a point. Can you really argue troy smith gave them a better chance to win. No, Singletary was a bumbling fool who wanted to try an take control and make an example. You can also make the argument the Shaun Hill got the job because he played in Martz system 2 years. Its a vicious cycle of devils advocate. The reality is his shoulder is healthy and his arm is fine.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 03:39 PM

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 03:42 PM

It seems the regime believes in Smith and doing everything to help him, THey just hired Chris Ault!! Dam good Hire!!

MagicHef

05-13-2013, 03:48 PM

The INTs seem very high... but otherwise, yes. He'll probably have more yards under Reid too.

He threw 12 INTs in 372 attempts in 2009. 17 in 560 attempts (35x16) doesn't seem like a reach.

Unless you're saying he'll miss too much time to throw that many attempts.

BossChief

05-13-2013, 03:51 PM

To say he's injury prone is spot-fucking on.

80 games played in 7 seasons. 11.4 per year.

Last I checked, the NFL plays 16 games per season.

So Alex Smith is missing over 4 games PER SEASON.

Only on CP can a guy miss 25% of his games and people say that the injury prone label is "kinda outawhack".

Or would you rather point out that he's missed games because he's been benched for scrubs like Shaun Hill?You didn't include the year he missed to injury.

He was drafted in 2005...8 seasons.

70 games started.

8.75 games started per year.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 03:52 PM

So he's either been injured or not good enough to start.

Sounds like a sound 2 2nd round pick investment.

Like i said before, its been almost 5 years with the shoulder. What more proof do you need that its far behind him? You need to turn the page man, your living on these things that happened back 6 7 years ago. As of late his play is the reason they Chiefs gave a second round pick. Do you think they would have done this had he continued the same path as 06 07 08? no way, he is here because of his play from 09-12. That is why he is a Chief. I have no idea if its gonna work out, we were 2-14 for gods sake. I sure hope for the best though.

OnTheWarpath15

05-13-2013, 03:53 PM

You didn't include the year he missed to injury.

He was drafted in 2005...8 seasons.

70 games started.

8.75 games started per year.

You're right. My mistake.

So he's missed damn near half of his career due to injury or being benched behind scrubs not named Kaepernick.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 03:56 PM

Like i said before, its been almost 5 years with the shoulder. What more proof do you need that its far behind him? You need to turn the page man, your living on these things that happened back 6 7 years ago. As of late his play is the reason they Chiefs gave a second round pick. Do you think they would have done this had he continued the same path as 06 07 08? no way, he is here because of his play from 09-12. That is why he is a Chief. I have no idea if its gonna work out, we were 2-14 for gods sake. I sure hope for the best though.

I dont care how good his numbers look on paper the last 2 years.

He wasn't an integral part of their offense which is why he was benched midway through last season because you can't ask him to be THE guy. He's trash.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 03:58 PM

He threw 12 INTs in 372 attempts in 2009. 17 in 560 attempts (35x16) doesn't seem like a reach.

Unless you're saying he'll miss too much time to throw that many attempts.

Different guy now. He won't force that many INTs, is what I am predicting. I was looking at the numbers offered, and I feel 17 INTs should be more like 12. Alex calculates risk, and won't force that many INTs, IMHO. Hopefully his targets won't have a Crabtree-like start and bobble up a bunch of free INTs that should have been caught. That was painful.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:00 PM

Um im sorry to have to say this, but that may be funniest thing ive ever heard. You just said the starting Qb of an NFL team is not an integral part of the offense. I have no more words for you.

jd1020

05-13-2013, 04:03 PM

Um im sorry to have to say this, but that may be funniest thing ive ever heard. You just said the starting Qb of an NFL team is not an integral part of the offense. I have no more words for you.

When you count on a top 2 defense, a running offensive attack, and <5 yard dump offs then you better damn well believe the QB is not an integral part of that offense. Any practice squad QB in the league could do what Alex Smith did the last 2 seasons.

For fuck sakes... Matt Cassel did it BETTER on an inferior team.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 04:06 PM

Jim Harbaugh resurrected Alex Smith's career. Smith was on the QB trash heap headed for career backup status before Harbaugh's coaching made him a serivceable starting QB. Now Alex is around mid pack in the 15-20 range of QBs.

Messier

05-13-2013, 04:07 PM

I never said that.
Posted via Mobile Device

What? I'm not saying you did.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:11 PM

jd1020

05-13-2013, 04:14 PM

its called being on a good balanced team, the niners do not have the philosophy of throwing 40 times a game and never will under harbaugh. The QB is the most important postion on the field and Runs the Offense for you to even suggest he in not integral is just moronic. If any practice squad player could do it they why arent they? If any practice squader can do it then just throw Bray out there and see what you get

Why don't you let Trent Dilfer know how integral he was to the Ravens success. He did the same shit Alex has been doing.

Congratulations Ravens! You have just won the Super Bowl! What are you going to do now?

....

Cut our QB!

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:16 PM

Hell yea he resurrected his career, what is wrong with that. He obviously saw something in him. Also coaches , coach. Players play. He can give the guy all the coaching he wants, but the player has to go out there and execute. Dont give coaches to much credit. at the end of the day they are on the sidelines watching like everyone else. Most coaches will say the same

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:17 PM

Why don't you let Trent Dilfer know how integral he was to the Ravens success. He did the same shit Alex has been doing.

Congratulations Ravens! You have just won the Super Bowl! What are you going to do now?

....

Cut our QB!

You forgot to highlight the best part, CONGRATULATIONS RAVENS< YOU JUST WON THE SUPERBOWL!

jd1020

05-13-2013, 04:18 PM

You forgot to highlight the best part, CONGRATULATIONS RAVENS< YOU JUST WON THE SUPERBOWL!

Pretty sure I mentioned that, but, like always, you missed the ****ing point.

BossChief

05-13-2013, 04:18 PM

You're right. My mistake.

So he's missed damn near half of his career due to injury or being benched behind scrubs not named Kaepernick.

And poof

All the Alex Myth slurpers ignore that glaring weakness

Messier

05-13-2013, 04:19 PM

Why don't you let Trent Dilfer know how integral he was to the Ravens success. He did the same shit Alex has been doing.

That's not accurate. The 49er defense is good, but not the overwhelming force the Ravens D was. They went, like 9 games or something without giving up a TD. Dilfer had to do almost nothing. That's not the case with the 49er at all.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 04:19 PM

its called being on a good balanced team, the niners do not have the philosophy of throwing 40 times a game and never will under harbaugh. The QB is the most important postion on the field and Runs the Offense for you to even suggest he in not integral is just moronic. If any practice squad player could do it they why arent they? If any practice squader can do it then just throw Bray out there and see what you get

The 49ers just wanted to pay Alex as the 2nd highest paid player on the team. They knew they could ask a practice squad player to do what he did.. but they enjoy throwing money around. :doh!: /sarcasm

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:22 PM

I get the point your trying to make, which is ridiculous. You cant even compare the 2 QBs, and i can guarantee you that Smith is not getting replaced with the likes of Elvis Grbac

MagicHef

05-13-2013, 04:33 PM

Different guy now. He won't force that many INTs, is what I am predicting. I was looking at the numbers offered, and I feel 17 INTs should be more like 12. Alex calculates risk, and won't force that many INTs, IMHO. Hopefully his targets won't have a Crabtree-like start and bobble up a bunch of free INTs that should have been caught. That was painful.

Here is a comprehensive list of QBs that threw at least 560 attempts and had 12 or fewer INTs:

1) Tom Brady
2) Peyton Manning

Does Alex Smith belong in that list?

jd1020

05-13-2013, 04:36 PM

I get the point your trying to make, which is ridiculous. You cant even compare the 2 QBs, and i can guarantee you that Smith is not getting replaced with the likes of Elvis Grbac

Can't compare game managers to each other?

Interesting.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 04:38 PM

Here is a comprehensive list of QBs that threw at least 560 attempts and had 12 or fewer INTs:

1) Tom Brady
2) Peyton Manning

Does Alex Smith belong in that list?

I see your point.. where where did the magical number of 560 attempts come up? Do we really expect Alex to be tossing it up 35 times a game for 16 games?

Messier

05-13-2013, 04:40 PM

Can't compare game managers to each other?

Interesting.

Trent Green was a game manager too. Can there be differing levels of game managers?

jd1020

05-13-2013, 04:40 PM

Trent Green was a game manager too. Can there be differing levels of game managers?

Here we go again.

penbrook

05-13-2013, 04:41 PM

Chiefs cut Nate Eachus and Ryan D Imperio.

Messier

05-13-2013, 04:42 PM

Here we go again.

Back at ya.

ayleswbj

05-13-2013, 04:43 PM

Can't compare game managers to each other?

Interesting.

So its ok to go back that long? Troy Aikman 20 td seasons? 1
4000yrd seasons? 0
career rating? 81
career ypa? 6.9

By your estimation Ultimate Game Manager i guess, if that is what gets you to a winning team ill take it.

patteeu

05-13-2013, 04:44 PM

And poof

All the Alex Myth slurpers ignore that glaring weakness

Speaking of ignoring, first Ricky Stanzi and then Geno Smith... how many strikes should we give you before we just ignore your forcefully articulated but hopelessly wrong opinions about QBs? You should change your name to CoMoOfQB.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 04:57 PM

http://i28.tinypic.com/2553ya0.jpg

You have my sympathy. It is what Alex brings to fan forums. Apparently the 49ers forum suffered through this for years.

It is now so peaceful on the 49ers forum, you have to search for threads on religion, abortion and gun control just to fight with somebody. o:-)

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 04:58 PM

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 04:59 PM

patteeu

05-13-2013, 04:59 PM

You have my sympathy. It is what Alex brings to fan forums. Apparently the 49ers forum suffered through this for years.

It is now so peaceful on the 49ers forum, you have to search for threads on religion, abortion and gun control just to fight with somebody. o:-)

It's such a horrible experience that you've followed Alex Smith here so you can suffer through it again. :)

BigCatDaddy

05-13-2013, 04:59 PM

Speaking of ignoring, first Ricky Stanzi and then Geno Smith... how many strikes should we give you before we just ignore your forcefully articulated but hopelessly wrong opinions about QBs? You should change your name to CoMoOfQB.

In his defense it looks Geno Smith will be the only starting QB of this class this year and there were about half dozen guys promoted on this forum as being "their guy".

patteeu

05-13-2013, 05:00 PM

In his defense it looks Geno Smith will be the only starting QB of this class this year and there were about half dozen guys promoted on this forum as being "their guy".

Tyler Palko was an NFL starting QB.

MagicHef

05-13-2013, 05:08 PM

I see your point.. where where did the magical number of 560 attempts come up? Do we really expect Alex to be tossing it up 35 times a game for 16 games?

Someone mentioned that Reid averaged 35 attempts per game. The 16 games part certainly may be unrealistic, though.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 05:49 PM

To say he's injury prone is spot-****ing on.

80 games played in 7 seasons. 11.4 per year.

Last I checked, the NFL plays 16 games per season.

So Alex Smith is missing over 4 games PER SEASON.

Only on CP can a guy miss 25% of his games and people say that the injury prone label is "kinda outawhack".

Or would you rather point out that he's missed games because he's been benched for scrubs like Shaun Hill?

QB Durability
(Active QBs, minimum 50 games starting)

Take this with a grain of salt as QBs with consistently solid O-lines won't take near the beating as teams with porous O-lines. This is just food for thought is all.

16.0 games/year - Joe Flacco
16.0 games/year - Eli Manning
16.0 games/year - Phillip Rivers
16.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do not count the neck injury)

15.9 games/year - Josh Freeman
15.6 games/year - Aaron Rodgers
15.6 games/year - Matt Ryan
15.5 games/year - Mark Sanchez
15.4 games/year - Drew Brees
15.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do count the neck injury)

14.7 games/year - Jay Cutler
14.7 games/year - Ben Roethlisberger
14.0 games/year - Sam Bradford

13.4 games/year - Carson Palmer
13.3 games/year - Tony Romo
13.2 games/year - Matt Schaub

12.5 games/year Alex Smith (Injuries only, no benchings)

11.4 games/year - Alex Smith (includes benchings)
11.2 games/year - Michael Vick
11.2 games/year - Matt Stafford

To the guy you were responding, factual data beats seat-of-the-pants opinion every time.

OnTheWarpath15

05-13-2013, 05:51 PM

QB Durability
(Active QBs, minimum 50 games starting)

Take this with a grain of salt as QBs with consistently solid O-lines won't take near the beating as teams with porous O-lines. This is just food for thought is all.

16.0 games/year - Joe Flacco
16.0 games/year - Eli Manning
16.0 games/year - Phillip Rivers
16.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do not count the neck injury)

15.9 games/year - Josh Freeman
15.6 games/year - Aaron Rodgers
15.6 games/year - Matt Ryan
15.5 games/year - Mark Sanchez
15.4 games/year - Drew Brees
15.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do count the neck injury)

14.7 games/year - Jay Cutler
14.7 games/year - Ben Roethlisberger
14.0 games/year - Sam Bradford

13.4 games/year - Carson Palmer
13.3 games/year - Tony Romo
13.2 games/year - Matt Schaub

11.4 games/year - Alex Smith (included benchings)
11.2 games/year - Michael Vick
11.2 games/year - Matt Stafford

To the guy you were responding, factual data beats seat-of-the-pants opinion every time.

Looks like you need to continue this, because it's been determined he actually only averages 8.75 games played per year.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 05:54 PM

Someone mentioned that Reid averaged 35 attempts per game. The 16 games part certainly may be unrealistic, though.

Alex won't be pitching it up 35 times a game... that's unrealistic.. unless you think the Chiefs run game and defense is ass.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 06:04 PM

I really dont get the whole "glass' or "injury prone" bit. His shoulder injury is going on 5 years now. That is a life time in the NFL. The shoulder is long behind him. What can you do about concussions in todays NFL? That the game we live in today. Your gonna sit, He was cleared to play the week after, Harbaugh had his window and went with it. To say he is injury prone is kinda outawhack.

Smith once again suffered an injured shoulder[30] in the 49ers week 7[31] game against the Carolina Panthers and was not available to play week 8 against the Denver Broncos in London. He was replaced by Troy Smith, who had 14 games of experience in the NFL before joining the 49ers organization just before the start of the regular season. Troy Smith took Smith's position after winning 2 straight victories against the St. Louis Rams and the Denver Broncos.[32]

It was Smith's non-throwing shoulder this time, but who knows how long it took to heal, given that Alex was benched for Troy Smith?

That was 3 seasons ago, but it confirms the concerns of Chiefs fans.

MagicHef

05-13-2013, 06:15 PM

Alex won't be pitching it up 35 times a game... that's unrealistic.. unless you think the Chiefs run game and defense is ass.

Are you unfamiliar with Andy Reid? He called 39 pass plays per game last season.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 06:17 PM

It's such a horrible experience that you've followed Alex Smith here so you can suffer through it again. :)

Nope. Just having fun watching Alex pollute somebody else's forum for a change.

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 06:40 PM

Looks like you need to continue this, because it's been determined he actually only averages 8.75 games played per year.

I'll check my math. I did an approximation. I'll be more accurate here...

Alex was on the 49ers roster for 8 full seasons. 8 x 16 = 128 games

Alex played in 80 games.

2005, Alex played 9 games missing 7 to injury.
2006, Alex played 16 games, missing 0.
2007, Alex played 7 games, missing 9 to injury.
2008, Alex played 0 games, missing 16 to injury.
2009, Alex played 11 games, missing 0 to injury, but was benched for 5 games.
2010, Alex played 11 games, missing 2 to injury, but was benched for 3 games.
2011, Alex played all 16 games.
2012, Alex played 7 games, missing 2 to injury, but was benched for 7 games.

Out of 128 games...
Alex played 77 games.
Alex missed 36 games to injury.
Alex was benched for 15 games.

Alex was benched for 15 games, so that is like losing an entire season, from 8 down to 7.

So durability wise, Alex played 77 games in 7 seasons = 11.0 games/year.

Including injury and benching, Alex played 77 games in 8 seasons = 9.6 games/year. I will correct my list...

Kaepernick

05-13-2013, 06:43 PM

QB Durability - Revised
(Active QBs, minimum 50 games starting)

Take this with a grain of salt as QBs with consistently solid O-lines won't take near the beating as teams with porous O-lines. This is just food for thought is all.

16.0 games/year - Joe Flacco
16.0 games/year - Eli Manning
16.0 games/year - Phillip Rivers
16.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do not count the neck injury)

15.9 games/year - Josh Freeman
15.6 games/year - Aaron Rodgers
15.6 games/year - Matt Ryan
15.5 games/year - Mark Sanchez
15.4 games/year - Drew Brees
15.0 games/year - Peyton Manning (If you do count the neck injury)

14.7 games/year - Jay Cutler
14.7 games/year - Ben Roethlisberger
14.0 games/year - Sam Bradford

13.4 games/year - Carson Palmer
13.3 games/year - Tony Romo
13.2 games/year - Matt Schaub

11.2 games/year - Michael Vick
11.2 games/year - Matt Stafford
11.0 games/year Alex Smith (Injuries only, no benchings)

9.6 games/year - Alex Smith (includes benchings)

Touche. Point made.

Pasta Little Brioni

05-13-2013, 06:50 PM

O.city

05-13-2013, 06:56 PM

Every move they've made has screamed win now. Why is it wrong for us to expect that they do so? Last year's 2 win season was a fluke, they won 7 the year before that with a far shittier team/QB situation/coaching.

This is more of why I'm expecting bigger things than "8-8 and sniffing the playoffs".

Yeah, it's a new system etc, but they are also keeping a similiar defensive system and our new QB is supposedly a very smart vet. Shouldn't take him much time.

But I also don't view last years team as a normal 2-14 team.

ChiefsCountry

05-13-2013, 06:57 PM

Its sad when the Broncos and Raider fans aren't the enemy on this board anymore.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 07:03 PM

Its sad when the Broncos and Raider fans aren't the enemy on this board anymore.

Truth. Yep, the enemy of the Chiefs seems to be a handful or so of Chiefs fans. :doh!:

Pasta Little Brioni

05-13-2013, 07:09 PM

This is more of why I'm expecting bigger things than "8-8 and sniffing the playoffs".

Yeah, it's a new system etc, but they are also keeping a similiar defensive system and our new QB is supposedly a very smart vet. Shouldn't take him much time.

But I also don't view last years team as a normal 2-14 team.

New system, but the old one was complete shit.

ChiefsCountry

05-13-2013, 07:15 PM

Truth. Yep, the enemy of the Chiefs seems to be a handful or so of Chiefs fans. :doh!:

See exhibit A of douchebag 49er trolls.

Sandy Vagina

05-13-2013, 07:20 PM

See exhibit A of douchebag 49er trolls.

Oh, be nice. I'm not so bad. Just sad to see so many Chiefs fans so miserable and defeated already. :D

BossChief

05-13-2013, 07:49 PM

Speaking of ignoring, first Ricky Stanzi and then Geno Smith... how many strikes should we give you before we just ignore your forcefully articulated but hopelessly wrong opinions about QBs? You should change your name to CoMoOfQB.
I've owned my fails on this board ever since I got here. If Stanzis career ends without him earning a chance to play, so be it. I advocated for spending a late second on the guy and it is what it is. A swing and a miss.

I love how you try to act as if Genos career is over, though.

Time will tell how that decisions ends up.

Let's look back in 4 years and see who made the better decisions.
I'll check my math. I did an approximation. I'll be more accurate here...

Alex was on the 49ers roster for 8 full seasons. 8 x 16 = 128 games

Alex played in 80 games.

2005, Alex played 9 games missing 7 to injury.
2006, Alex played 16 games, missing 0.
2007, Alex played 7 games, missing 9 to injury.

2008, Alex played 0 games, missing 16 to injury.
2009, Alex played 11 games, missing 0 to injury, but was benched for 5 games.
2010, Alex played 11 games, missing 2 to injury, but was benched for 3 games.
2011, Alex played all 16 games.
2012, Alex played 7 games, missing 2 to injury, but was benched for 7 games.

Out of 128 games...
Alex played 77 games.
Alex missed 36 games to injury.
Alex was benched for 15 games.

Alex was benched for 15 games, so that is like losing an entire season, from 8 down to 7.

So durability wise, Alex played 77 games in 7 seasons = 11.0 games/year.

Including injury and benching, Alex played 77 games in 8 seasons = 936 games/year. I will correct my list...
fuck all that nonsense.

Alex Smith started a grand total of 75 games for the 49ers according to profootballreference

That's only 58% of the games played by the 49ers since he was drafted.

I don't care about the reasons.

Being effective when healthy is part of availability.
(http://http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SmitAl03.htm?mobile=false)

Marcellus

05-13-2013, 07:51 PM

**** all that nonsense.

Alex Smith started a grand total of 75 games for the 49ers according to profootballreference

That's only 58% of the games played by the 49ers since he was drafted.

I don't care about the reasons.

Being effective when healthy is part of availability.
(http://http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SmitAl03.htm?mobile=false)

Yea I am sure that's your big concern.